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1775 Mexico 8 Escudos - Tests 91%+ Au, But Low Weight - Counterfeit ?

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Valued Member
MasterKromm's Avatar
United States
110 Posts
 Posted 07/23/2022  07:15 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add MasterKromm to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I recently acquired a 1775 Mexico 8 Escudos coin from a dealer acquaintance in Spain. I don't ask him to weigh the coins because, after 4+ years of doing business with him I have not been disappointed... That said, while the coin looks the part, tests as 91.67%+ gold and has the correct diameter - it is fairly underweight @ 24.941 grams. Were there any one off's with higher gold content but lower weight? Also, have there been any known examples of well made counterfeits i.e. looks the part and is made of gold? Oh and if a well made counterfeit, would it have any "collector" value above and beyond it's gold value?

Thanks in advance, and any insight would be much appreciated!


1775-Mexico-8-Escudos---Tests-91%+-Au,-But-Low-Weight---Counterfeit-?
1775-Mexico-8-Escudos---Tests-91%+-Au,-But-Low-Weight---Counterfeit-?
1775-Mexico-8-Escudos---Tests-91%+-Au,-But-Low-Weight---Counterfeit-?
1775-Mexico-8-Escudos---Tests-91%+-Au,-But-Low-Weight---Counterfeit-?
Pillar of the Community
United States
684 Posts
 Posted 07/24/2022  10:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Westwood Arms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This interesting. I don't know how it was made, maybe drilling into the coin through the edge and replacing the gold? There are no known underweight "one offs" made at the mint. There are really good colonial gold counterfeits like I saw on display at a coin show. If this is a counterfeit made when this coin circulated ( contemporary counterfeit) it has value greater than the gold content.
Valued Member
MasterKromm's Avatar
United States
110 Posts
 Posted 07/25/2022  5:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MasterKromm to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@ Westwood Arms

Thanks for the reply! The coin is solid gold. The Sigma Metalytics Verifier Pro's sensors go through the entire coin... I am stumped. What would a contemporary counterfeit be worth? I don't collect counterfeits, but if I can make my money back I don't mind and will simply sell it. Otherwise, if it isn't all that collectible I will likely send it back for a refund or a credit towards another gold coin later.

Anyone else have any insight, ideas or suggestions?

Thanks again!
Valued Member
United States
131 Posts
 Posted 07/25/2022  10:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add threefifty to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi MasterKromm - I've read a little bit on the Sigma Metalytics analyzer and it is basically a metal detector. As a metal detectorist I can tell you from experience that it probably works best for obvious fakes with base metal cores. I would recommend a specific gravity test by water displacement to get better info, or an XRF test. That might be able to better tell you what kind of a contemporary counterfeit it is.

To try to answer you other question, it may be best to send it back for a refund if you are able. For 8 escudos, my observations have been that contemporary counterfeits sell well if they have high gold content or are gilt platinum. Also cruder counterfeits (e.g. struck with hand-engraved dies) do well. This is a nice piece but it doesn't seem to me like a slam dunk that it would sell for more than a genuine coin. Just my 2 cents and I look forward to hearing from other posters with more experience.
Edited by threefifty
07/25/2022 10:21 pm
New Member
Spain
3 Posts
 Posted 09/05/2022  03:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add i6n4c10 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi

Imho... The weight is very low... but doing a counterfeit with no similar weight does not seem good to me.
Sometimes, not very often, you can find this kind of underweight.
The coin is not in great condition neither so I guess it wouldn't cost you very far from gold-weight.
I can't find any aspect but the weight to make me suspect the coin is not authentic, but I'd reject coins this weight. Too many scratches as well...
I am pretty sure the dealer is honest, but if you'd like to comment me any detail privately, please feel free.

There are really good colonial gold counterfeits like I saw on display at a coin show. If this is a counterfeit made when this coin circulated ( contemporary counterfeit) it has value greater than the gold content.

@Westwood Arms -> I'd really love to see good photos from those...

Regards
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