Coin Community Family of Web Sites Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors
Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes. 300,000 items to help build your collection! Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall Shop for APMEX Bullion on eBay!Specializing in Modern Numismatics Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

2001 P Kentucky State Quarter Mint Error - Cud

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 6 / Views: 835Next Topic  
Pillar of the Community
tropicalbats's Avatar
United States
6108 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2023  02:35 am Show Profile   Check tropicalbats's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add tropicalbats to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Spent some time staring at the two Cuds from this year that are nearly identical, but I am pretty sure I got this right based on the shape of the lower cut-over to the rim. It always baffles me how dies do not break randomly, but tend to break in the same place over the course of a year run. I know it can be strongly related to the devices near the rim, but so many Cuds from one year can just look so similar but not be exactly the same.

2001-P Kentucky State Quarter mint error - CU-25C-2001P-02R


2001-P-Kentucky-State-Quarter-Mint-Error---Cud
2001-P-Kentucky-State-Quarter-Mint-Error---Cud
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
Petespockets55's Avatar
United States
5770 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2023  04:30 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It can be a strain figuring out which one they are on some years.
Congrats.
Words of encouragement are one of the major food groups.
We need to consume them regularly to thrive and grow.
Edited by Petespockets55
03/08/2023 04:31 am
Moderator
Learn More...
nickelsearcher's Avatar
United States
15395 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2023  05:33 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nickelsearcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
It always baffles me how dies do not break randomly



Quote:
I know it can be strongly related to the devices near the rim


I can offer an explanation based on my engineering experiences:

If you consider the die surfaces and devices from a metallurgical standpoint there is absolutely a wide distribution of stresses imparted on the die during the coin striking process.

The largest magnitude stress occurs where the devices make sharp turns such as a 90 degree angle - these locations are known as 'stress concentrations'.

It is these stress concentration locations where the strain (think local elongation) on the underlying metal is the greatest and eventually the repeated stress/strain at that location causes the metal to fracture.

All metals have a fatigue life - and when the repeat stress and resulting strain cycles add up eventual small cracks then ultimately fractures will occur.

Think about opening a steel paperclip and bending it back and forth numerous times about one point - that is essentially what is happening at the stress concentration points in a die.

If those stress concentration points happen to be near the rim, with corresponding stress cycling, then Cuds will appear over time in apparently the 'same' location because, well, all of the die devices for a particular design are the same.

I have no doubt that metallurgists at the US Mint try their best to 'encourage' die designs that minimize stress concentration points - but if they had freedom over die design we would end up with quite bland coinage free of sharp corners in the devices.

So - cheer for your Cuds - they are an example of metallurgy responding to elegant die features.

Edit to add - the same metallurgical reasoning applies to why we find die cracks in similar locations across a series of coins. A classic example are the die cracks that begin at the lower corner of the Lincoln Memorial on the reverse of a LMC. That sharp corner of the building is a strong stress concentration point - and those cracks are the result of metal fatigue leading to local failure from repeated stress and strain cycling.

Hope all that makes sense!
Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art
Edited by nickelsearcher
03/08/2023 07:25 am
Bedrock of the Community
Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2023  09:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice, congrats!
Pillar of the Community
tropicalbats's Avatar
United States
6108 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2023  09:19 am  Show Profile   Check tropicalbats's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add tropicalbats to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow. Thank you so much for that thoughtful and detailed explanation as I really learned a lot from reading it. It is always a great day when I can wake up and learn something interesting from a professional, and today is such a day. Again, thank you for taking the time to really put me on the road to actually understanding why these things happen as they do.
Moderator
Learn More...
nickelsearcher's Avatar
United States
15395 Posts
 Posted 03/08/2023  7:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nickelsearcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Truly my pleasure @bats to share those insights with you.

I've long admired your taxonomy knowledge to classify errors and varieties - true expertise on the topics.

Hopeful that my brief layman explanation of the metallurgical dynamics help you and others begin to understand the metal failures we classify as 'die cracks' or 'chips' or ' Cuds'

Next time you view a Cud - look at the base coin and simply imagine the hundred of thousands of stress cycles that tiny sharp device corner went through.

It can all be explained through the study of properties of materials - but I would prefer to return the thread to the OP.
Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art
Moderator
Learn More...
Dearborn's Avatar
United States
95018 Posts
  Previous TopicReplies: 6 / Views: 835Next Topic  

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.34 seconds to rattle this change. Forums