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1 Franc [1888], Ceres - Grading

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Pillar of the Community

Portugal
674 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2023  10:10 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add jecz79 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Went to get a medal, left with some irresistible francs.

I will not have this graded but would like to have opinions. What grade would you give it?

1-Franc-[1888],-Ceres---Grading

There are some very shallow scratches near the RA in the obverse. Visible because the surface did not suffer the same oxidation there. But seem to be planchet or minting defects.
Visible also is a faint die crack impression across the AISE.
Absolutely no wear and only that slight oxidation at the top.

1-Franc-[1888],-Ceres---Grading

The french had some very nice designs. Before the twentieth century.
Edited by jecz79
10/05/2023 10:19 pm
Bedrock of the Community
Errers and Varietys's Avatar
United States
74707 Posts
 Posted 10/05/2023  11:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Errers and Varietys to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am not the best at grading, but maybe high AU to MS.
Errers and Varietys.
Bedrock of the Community
sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2023  12:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
E & V has said it right.
As a general rule, Europeans do not grade their coins using the Sheldon grading scale, - they use their own. As such, AU to MS looks about right.
Pillar of the Community
Portugal
674 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2023  06:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jecz79 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Being european, I know but I was still curious how americans would grade it on that 0-70 scale.
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2023  08:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Can't see any significant wear under magnification on the high points of the design, both sides.
Sheldon MS-62.

I can understand why it the OP posted it, - it is a nice coin.
Edited by sel_69l
10/06/2023 08:54 am
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2023  08:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Can you give us straight-on shots like the first set but with the lighting of the second set?
Pillar of the Community
Portugal
674 Posts
 Posted 10/06/2023  09:05 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jecz79 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am just daylight but that first one with the sun made the coin look darker. Perhaps this is better? Had to photograph that way to get more natural color. Still not a good photographer

1-Franc-[1888],-Ceres---Grading
Pillar of the Community
Portugal
674 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2023  5:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jecz79 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry shinny silver is difficult to photograph.
@Coinfrog I hope this one is better.

1-Franc-[1888],-Ceres---Grading

My curiosity is also how what you think of the oxidation. What influence does it have on grading in that Sheldon scale.

And of those surface disturbances in the FR area. They are very shallow marks but the oxidation around makes them visible by contrast. Should they properly be described as scratches?

1-Franc-[1888],-Ceres---Grading

The A at the bottom of that photography also has the beginning of the die crack that is only noticeable over the AISE.
Edited by jecz79
10/08/2023 5:41 pm
Pillar of the Community
Portugal
674 Posts
 Posted 10/18/2023  6:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jecz79 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I understand no one wants to risk an opinion?

I wanted to ask about this one because I found it very attractive. But also because of those tiny scratches in the FR spare.

It is not the first time I have seen a coin with otherwise perfect surfaces and bearing that kind of disturbance in some small area.

I have been wondering how these happen.
If they may happen in the planchet and not be erased by the strike?
If they may be a product of the minting itself, some garbage in the die?
If they are later damage due to some dirt or grain scratching the surface.

And if they condemn a coin for most collectors, or are seen as a minor distraction.

This was an especially good coin to ask about it because the oxidation there makes it more visible. I have seen several other mint state coins with similar small surface marks, and over time even added some to my collection. Always assumed mint damage. Here it is a "superb" coin and there is no more to tell.

Only recently I became more aware of the grading practices in North America, the Sheldon scale and also those classifications of 'details'. I have wondered how this was looked at there.

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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 10/18/2023  7:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Can't see any evident flaws, I'll say MS-65 Sheldon.
Pillar of the Community
Portugal
674 Posts
 Posted 10/18/2023  7:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jecz79 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That is nice. I was afraid that small flaw alone would make a coin be disregarded. The details thing.

Why don't those with some scratch get evaluated anyway, with a note about being scratched?
After looking at how US coins are evaluated I have been more curious about how that scale applies. And when and why a coin is dismissed as ungradeable.

Would still collect it. This one was legal currency in my country. Worth 200 reis at the time.
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IndianGoldEagle's Avatar
United States
36839 Posts
 Posted 11/06/2023  8:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add IndianGoldEagle to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice coin. MS-65.
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