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 Replies: 24 / Views: 11,097 |
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Valued Member
United States
74 Posts |
not sure if this has been discussed. what kind of fireproof/waterproof safes do you recommend? I have been researching them because I need to buy one. I see some half 1/2 hour fire ratings...some 1 hour. some water proof, some water resistant. who makes good safes?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6326 Posts |
There is no such thing as a "fireproof" safe. They only make them "resistant" for a certain temperature, for a brief time at that temperature. "Waterproof" is not too likely either.......nor "humidity proof" (which is important too) A flood "WILL" damage everything in your safe......guaranteed ! And, perhaps most important......if a thief knows there's a safe in there, or discovers one while he's in there.....he will just make " YOU" open it for him !.....(with a gun to your head or a loved ones head, you'll open ANY safe in two seconds for him !) Look at this too.......eventually people will know that you're a coin collector....through so many different ways. Your childrens friends, Your friends, coworkers, "friends" of your friends, neighbors, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc......the circle is ever widening and ever expanding and ever changing for the rest of your life ! So, although the convienience isn't wonderful......I keep mine in Safety Deposit Boxes down at the bank !!  I always have the ability to "temporarily" bring things home from there to "work on" or "look at"......so it's just fine. I don't have to worry about fire. I don't have to worry about a flood. I don't have to worry about robbery. And these are some of the most common ways "coin collectors" are parted from their collections ! |
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Valued Member
 United States
74 Posts |
very wise advice. thank you
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1745 Posts |
I too use a saftey deposit box, but am considering a small safe for the times I have some items at home for a visit.
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Moderator
 United States
56855 Posts |
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Valued Member
United States
377 Posts |
Eagle Quote:
I don't have to worry about fire.
I don't have to worry about a flood.
I don't have to worry about robbery. I hate to be the one to say it but, Banks Do Burn Banks Do Flood and Yes they can be robbed  |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
Despite popular opinion, bank/safety deposit vaults are not always properly climate controlled for coins. Many vaults are on an exterior wall of a bank, making climate control even more difficult. Before you open a deposit box for the purpose of storing coins, it is best to question the bank manager about the ambient conditions of the vault- if they have no idea then that is not a good bank to store your little preciouses. The best(worst?) example I have seen of this is a story that was told to me by a friend and old time collector. He had accumulated a complete Indian Head cent collection throughout the 60s and 70s with the majority being MS RD-RB and they were stored in a Whitman album. They were in a safety deposit box for about 10 years until he was interested in selling a few of them to another collector. He removed them from the vault and once at home with good light and a magnifier, he could tell that the coins were in worse shape than when he put them in there- the RD coins had developed spots and some of the RB coins were completely BN and ugly. His box was on an outside wall and in winter the humidity levels of the vault caused condensation on the coins  What should have been a $10,000+ collection at that time ended up being liquidated for about $2,500  He has not kept coins in his safety deposit box since, instead relying on a hidden, walled-in safe(with lots o' desiccant) somewhere in his house. To this day, he has not had any environmental problems with his coins. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6326 Posts |
wif99.....Quote:
Banks Do Burn
Banks Do Flood
and Yes they can be robbed ...  Of course I knew "someone" would say that ! ... But it's of course a matter of "odds"..... Here's my take on these "counterpoints" :A bank being robbed.....My town (I live in the capitol city) has bank robberies ALL OF THE TIME !.......but NEVER have I heard of a robbery involving safety deposit boxes in " my" town !....they just walk inside with a gun and a mask and approach the tellers with an empty bag and say "fill this with money", they of course don't take the "time" to go through 340 safety deposit boxes !, they're in a bit of a hurry !........so......I'm not worried AT ALL about my safety deposit boxes being robbed ! Next....... fire.......yes.....it's possible that a bank may have a fire......however.......a fire "at home" IS JUST MORE LIKELY TO HAPPEN ! In my 40 years, I've NEVER heard of ONE SINGLE BANK EVER HAVING A FIRE IN "MY" TOWN....... NOT ONE ! Maybe that's a regular occurance in other towns.....but it's nonexistant here, yet, at home....it's " always" a possibility. Next...... the bank involved in a flood........yes.....this is more likely than the other two......but again.....odds are in your favor with this....I would never say that banks aren't built in "flood plains".....but I'd say if you live in a constant flood problem area........choose a bank on high ground ! Bio.... makes some good points on the potential drawbacks to SDB's ........(and by the way.... and IMHO, BIO is in a top 5 group of the smartest/most knowledgable/logical/common sensible people on CCF ! So I always "sit up" and "pay close attention" when reading his posts !) My banks SDB's are "interior located" not on an outside wall or partition......so I'm good with that. I use the moisture packs in there too.......just to be safe, even though my banks SDB area is "supposed" to be climate controlled......I don't take the chance !.....too many silver and gold Proof coins in there ! ..... But, for me, this is BY FAR the best choice for me to make when considering safe storage of my coins.....
Edited by eaglefoot
05/28/2009 4:27 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1248 Posts |
Re: Sentry safesI had a sentry safe full of slabbed coins. needed to go away for a few days and took the safe to my basement. on the way down I slipped, the safe became airborn and fell from about 3 feet to a concrete floor..... guess what?  it broke!!!1, the lid just broke off. coins all over.. ONE WOULD THINK A SAFE WOULD WITHSTAND A FALL FROM 3-4 FEET? I contacted Sentry to see what they had to say.....NOTHING!! since last June!! someone said someone would get back to me... I am still waiting.. would be happy to take close up pictures of the broken safe... I must say that NOWHERE in the small print was any mention of breaking. I guess if you avoid a subject , you do not need to address it.... HHB |
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Valued Member
United States
377 Posts |
I have A Sentry Safe and Love it.
But can't carry it.
Eagle: Just out of curiosity what would a SDB cost me?
My 23.6 Cubic foot safe is full
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1231 Posts |
Sentry safes can be pried open with a big screwdriver or a crowbar easily. They only are good for a decoy safe. And as HHB noted they don't cover impacts.
All basic safes use a typical fir rating system from none to up to a few hours. Most safes typical put the level at between 1600-1850 degrees for the specified amount of time. For example a 2 hour fire rating will protect the safe for up to 2 hours at 1850 degrees. The inside temp will have a typical rating of not exceeding 350 degrees.
A media/data safe has a typical fire rating also, but in addition it has a lower internal temp rating like 125 degrees and also won't exceed 80% humidity inside the safe.
Labels Use On Burglary Safes
These safes are designed to protect your valuables ( money, jewelry etc.) As a rule they offer very little protection against fire. Burglary safes are rated on how long they will be able to withstand an attack using power tools and in some cases cutting torches and high explosives.
B rate - simply means your safe is equipped with a combination lock and some type of external relocking device. Both door and body are 1/2 inch steel. Most are small safes that can be easily carried off if not bolted down. It is not recommend that valuables be left in these safes over night.
C rate - a safe with a door 1 inch thick door and body 1/2 inch thick.
E rate - a safe with a 1 1/2 inch thick door and a 1 inch thick body.
TL 15 - a safe that must weigh at least 750 pounds and resist expert attack using power tools for a net working time of 15 minutes.
TL 30 - a safe that must weigh at least 750 pounds and resist expert attack
using power tools for a net working time of 30 minutes.
TRTL 15 / TRTL 30 - same as above but also must resist expert attack by a cutting torch during the attack
TRTL60 - a safe that must weigh at least 750 pounds and be able to resist expert attack by both power tools and cutting torch for a net working time of 60 minutes
TXTL60 - a safe that must weigh at least 1000 pounds and resist expert attack by power tools , cutting torches and high explosives for a net working time of 60 minutes. (no longer produced to my knowledge)
Net Working Time: The actual time working. It does not include the time required to change worn out or broken drill bits and saw blades, replace drill motors to hot to handle or any other of the many things that takes place during these test.
Composite Body Safes
These are becoming the most widely use class of safe used in business today as they offer both fire and burglary protection. With the TL15 , TL30 and TRTL 30 being the most popular. There is also another rating this style safe can be found in. It is known as the X6 (ie. TRTL30X6). This simply means that any barrier that can be found in the door to resist attack can also be found in the top, bottom and sides offering even more protection for your valuables.
A TXTL-60 type safe is the best you can buy, but you better have lots and lots of money to spend. This type of safe can successfully resist entry for a net assault time of 60 minutes when attacked with common hand tools, picking tools, mechanical or portable electric tools, grinders, drills ,pressure devices, explosives and oxy-fuel gas cutting or welding torches.
Also any safe over 25 years old typically won't be protected for fire with an insurance company. It would only be covered for burglary.
Each person has to decide what is best for them. Here are some of the things you need to decide. You have to determine if it is worth purchasing a safe or a SDB. The value of your collection can be a deciding factor. Do you live in a high crime area? How many people are going to see it being delivered? And there are countless other questions you can ask yourself.
Hope this helps some
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New Member
United States
25 Posts |
I compared safes for months when I was looking to up grade, and there are many out there, anywhere from 500 to 5000 dollars and up. Some of the better safes are AMSEC(American Security) Protex, Fire Fyter, and Cobalt. but I bought a Patriot in the end as I felt it was the best built and best priced for my needs. Although it is not waterproof it is water resistant and it is fire resistant. keep in mind most home fires burn less then 30 minutes In floor safes are another great choice if you have a concrete floor in your house.hope this helps. http://www.patriotsafe.com/gun-safes-30x20x20.html |
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New Member
United States
25 Posts |
one more thing, they do make safe de-humidifiers, although I never used one because I live in the south west where the humidity is very very low
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New Member
United States
25 Posts |
Sorry I hate to keep posting but... check out http://www.amsecusa.com/ they make some quality and beautiful safes with the nicest interiors I've seen. not sure of your price range, they are very pricey, but for coin collectors they would be perfect IMO |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
Awesome breakdown on safe ratings onejinx |
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Valued Member
United States
74 Posts |
ya thanks onejinx that is very helpful
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Replies: 24 / Views: 11,097 |
Posted 05/28/2009 12:14 pm
