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Help To Identify Coin - 1610/1616 (Id: 1610 Gelderland/Spanish Netherlands Oord)

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rikcando's Avatar
Canada
287 Posts
 Posted 06/12/2009  5:07 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add rikcando to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
My last unidentified coin, and I'm not even sure what year it is. I was told it was 1610, but I believe it is more likely 1616, or even 1618.
Closest I came was an Austrian coin, but I cannot account for the coat of arms on the reverse (or obverse, I have a hard time with that on older coins).

Thanks again in advance.




Help-To-Identify-Coin---1610/1616-Id:-1610-Gelderland/Spanish-Netherlands-Oord

Help-To-Identify-Coin---1610/1616-Id:-1610-Gelderland/Spanish-Netherlands-Oord
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rikcando's Avatar
Canada
287 Posts
 Posted 06/12/2009  6:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rikcando to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
if it helps at all, here is some of the lettering around the rim.


Help-To-Identify-Coin---1610/1616-Id:-1610-Gelderland/Spanish-Netherlands-Oord
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Belgium
651 Posts
 Posted 06/13/2009  03:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bart to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is indeed not an easy one: it is a liard from the Spanish Netherlands, issued in the names of Albert and Elisabeth of Austria.
Philip II of Spain legated the Netherlands to his daughter Elisabeth and her husband Albert of Habsburg as a personal domain, which could be inherited by their children. As they died childless, the Spanish Netherlands returned to the Spanish crown.

This liard was issued during their reign, possibly at the Roermond Mint (a town in the nowadays Netherlands). Legends read: ALBERTUS ET ELISABET ARCHEDUCES AUSTR. DU ? = Albert and Elisabeth, archdukes of Austria, dukes of ?
The year must be 1610
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
16842 Posts
 Posted 06/13/2009  03:41 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It appears to be from the Spanish Netherlands, issued in the name of the co-rulers of the Seventeen Provinces, Archduke Albert of Austria and his wife the Infanta Isabella of Spain. They reigned from 1598 to 1621, so both 1610 and 1616 are possibilities. The text around the coin should be: ALBERTVS ET ELIS D G around the coat of arms, and ARCHIDVC AVST DVC BVRG; the next letters will tell you the province the coin was issued. It looks for all the world like GEL, but Gelderland was part of the Dutch Republic at the time. It might be a badly corroded C FL instead, which would make it County of Flanders.

The Krause cataloge for the 1600's is woefully un-illustrated, so I don't know what the denomination of your coin might be. What's the diameter?
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Belgium
651 Posts
 Posted 06/13/2009  07:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bart to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Sap,

If you can see GEL, than it is definetely a liard (oord in Dutch) of Albert and Isabella (Elisabeth), minted at Roermond.
The full legends must be: ALBERTVS ET ELISABET ARCHEDUCES AVSTR. DV. GEL (Albert and Elisabeth, archdukes of Austria, dukes of Gelderland).

Gelderland was indeed part of the Republic of the Netherlands at that time, but the War of Independence was not over yet, and during the reign of Albert and Isabella, there was a twelve year peace period. Hence the claim of Gelderland by the rulers of the Spanish Netherlands.

PS. For coins of the Spanish Netherlands, I use the book "Atlas der munten van België van de Kelten tot heden" (Atlas of the Belgian coins from the Celts until now) by Hugo Vanhoudt. It gives no values, but is widely used for determinations. rickando's coin is in this book as a oord (liard)Vanhoudt# I-429. It was struck 1606-1612.
Edited by bart
06/13/2009 07:03 am
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rikcando's Avatar
Canada
287 Posts
 Posted 06/13/2009  08:38 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rikcando to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Oh, thank you both very very much. Really truly thank you.

I'm of to the library now, and if I have to, the book store. I haven't been collecting very long, and I don't collect coins as much for graded value, but more so for the stories behind them, and these were my first one outside of N. America.

Again, thanks. I love his site.
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