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1892 Indian Head W/ Raised Lines On The Face

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Seventh1's Avatar
United States
21 Posts
 Posted 01/10/2010  7:06 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Seventh1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
still learning about errors and found this in my Indian Heads. Thought at first it was scratches but on closer the lines are raised. Any ideas?

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face
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 Posted 01/10/2010  7:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add zeewool to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
They are most likely knife or razor cuts that have lifted the silver slightly. Subsequent wear to the coin will cause the raised metal to widen and appear as if the cause were die oriented.
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DVCollector's Avatar
United States
10045 Posts
 Posted 01/10/2010  9:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't have the Snow attribution guide for 1892, but perhaps someone here can better describe the Snow-14 "scarface" variety. I assume that it denotes some heavy die damage on the portrait. While I cannot say for sure from the pic, I'll take your word that the lines are raised. If you shoot the coin under several lighting angles, that might help everyone to tell better.
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Seventh1's Avatar
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21 Posts
 Posted 01/11/2010  4:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Seventh1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
took me a while but I think this is about the best I can do

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face
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DVCollector's Avatar
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10045 Posts
 Posted 01/12/2010  2:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Those pics help, because I think I'm seeing raised lines--right?
So...if they're raised, they most likely originated on the die.
Can anyone confirm markers for the 1892 S-14 "scarface"?
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livingdinasaur's Avatar
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1571 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2010  3:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add livingdinasaur to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Kurt, If you can have them make shots of A, the face area, 3/4 face, B, last feather tip, and C, the date areaclose in.
Looking at the pgotos shown, and the three area requested, my first impression is not good.
I am looking at the three views, at this moment.
Dick
Edited by livingdinasaur
01/14/2010 3:56 pm
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DVCollector's Avatar
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10045 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2010  4:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Dick,
Just giving him the benefit of the doubt, lacking proper documentation here I cannot say better.
If I had the coin in-hand, I might say different. Then again, Rick Snow himself could say better for a modest fee.
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xshift's Avatar
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2669 Posts
 Posted 01/14/2010  5:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add xshift to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Mind posting a large picture of the entire obverse and reverse?

Scarface has 'numerous raised lines on the portrait and surrounding field' on the obverse (face, last feather tip, date area), and - Reverse P: Olive leaf and shield points connected to the denticles.



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Seventh1's Avatar
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21 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2010  09:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Seventh1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
sorry for the delay in posting new images but hopefully these will help

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face

1892-Indian-Head-W/-Raised-Lines-On-The-Face
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biokemist6's Avatar
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12437 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2010  11:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
They are cuts/scrapes that have displaced the metal, raising it up on one side. Anything that was there at the time of minting would not survive fully intact with wear down to the G/VG level.
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DVCollector's Avatar
United States
10045 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2010  11:10 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yep, after seeing more of the coin, that's the only possibility. We're not looking at struck surfaces here.
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Seventh1's Avatar
United States
21 Posts
 Posted 01/28/2010  3:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Seventh1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
thanks for helping me out
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 Posted 01/28/2010  3:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add zeewool to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Glad to see the correct assessment has been arrived at. You guys were beginning to scare me.
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xshift's Avatar
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2669 Posts
 Posted 01/28/2010  11:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add xshift to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Nah.. we just don't dismiss anything out of hand - the possibilities are always endless. Like DV said, giving the benefit of the doubt. At least until we can tell for sure
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aladinslamp's Avatar
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3076 Posts
 Posted 01/29/2010  12:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aladinslamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have to agree there..reaching for the stars is not wrong.......but sometimes
(LIKE NOW LOL) is not the time....post mint damage from the start.....and to the finish......
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DVCollector's Avatar
United States
10045 Posts
 Posted 01/29/2010  12:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Nah.. we just don't dismiss anything out of hand

there's nothing lost by holding snap judgments...for better pics.
Big difference between holding a coin in-hand and looking at a few cropped photos--imo.
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