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Breaking News To Someone About A Coin They Own

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New Member
United States
11 Posts
 Posted 12/14/2010  11:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Enso999 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would tell him to have verified by a professional coin dealer. This way you're not the one telling him the bad news.
Pillar of the Community
United States
958 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  12:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coppertop5150 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So I went back to her house around 7pm tonight.

I explained it was a double die cent . ( thanks copper coins and the others)
It just was not the " big one " that most collectors want.
She told me he had some double die 55 cents some 2,000$ plus
and the $400 was the only one in her price range.

Im retty sure she prob said " wow those are expensive do you have anything cheaper " how much do you want to spend "uhhh I dunno maybe 300-400 dollars " He prob directed her to that 55-d

So I'm not sure if the dealer priced it wrong, or weather he just made up aprice to see if she would buy the coins becuase it was the only thing " in her price range "
Alot of his coins are not marked .

The coins is a double die , do I do feel atleast alil better he did not sell her a machined double.



I am going to call the dealer and ask what his return policey is ,

But to be quit frank the lady does not sound like she wants to return it. Becuase she knows she cant find a realy double die and her husbands seemed happy with it

her exact words are " oh he will be so dissapointed , well its the thought that counts "

Even though this thought cost her 400$ for a 10$ coin....

Im gonna call the dealer and say my mom bought a coin for my dad there a few days ago what is your return /exchange policey and see how the convo goes.
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Maineman750's Avatar
United States
3592 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  07:39 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Maineman750 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you went to her house, why didn't you just ask her the conversation she had with the dealer ? That way you would know what really happened instead of speculating ?
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United States
958 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  09:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coppertop5150 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well I did ask her,she kinda him and hummed. I know her personality and she really is very innocent in the world we live in.

This is the kind of person she is. She gives to street bums, drops 15% in the church plate,gives everyone the benifit of the doubt, drives under the speed limit, does not think anyone would lie to her ,thinks it o.k and can not think that anyone would rip her off becuase she would never think of ripping anyone off.

So for her to even think she got ripped off is out of the question.

Im gonna call the dealer when it opens , I think its around 10-11 just a few hours away. She paid with a charge card and the date showed it was Nov 26 the day after thanksgiving .

Explains it all ,Said she heard her hubby tell another family member that the 55 dd was the only one mhe didnt have
so with out asking him for advice or doing any research she went out the next day and bought one.
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Scooby Due's Avatar
United States
4000 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  11:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Scooby Due to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Didn't he notice the D mintmark?
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Maineman750's Avatar
United States
3592 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  11:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Maineman750 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Really, I'm thinking you're wasting your time...maybe her husband will get to the bottom of it but it sounds like she doesn't have the motivation.
Pillar of the Community
United States
958 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  11:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coppertop5150 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
well here it is
,

I told him about what the coin is worth in the price guides and that its a D minted coin. Not a 1955 DD like she wanted

the convo went like this
Hello blah blah

My mother bought a coin at your shop I think she bought the wrong coin, or the coins was marked wrong in price
She bought a 1955-d double die coin
" I cant remeber I have seen alot of people in the last few weeks and sold a few 55 coins "
I said it was purchased on nov 26th for $400
" I still dont know what coin or who bought it "
Its marked 55-d ddo1 xf40+ red/brown the reciept says it came from your shop and paid with a charge card
"well thats past my 3day right of return policey "
I said the coin prices out much less then $400 and I think a mistake was made and would hate to think she might have gotten taken advantage of
"well who says it prices less then $400 , are you a coin expert do you appraise coins for a living "
Said I matched the coins discription to the current RedBook price list
" You cant go by the price guides ,a coin is worth what someone is willing to pay for it , I have sold lots of coins below price guide values and above price guide values .The price guide is just that a piece of paper with someones opinions of what a price should be.
I see , so you think a coind worth 10-25$ sold to a person for $400 is a fair deal
"well the coin was not worth only 10-23$ the coin was worth $400 becuase someone paid $400"
So you wont do a store credit , take back or return?
" its way past my return policey , I dont force people to buy coins , I tell my price they can buy the coin or they can go to another shop , anything else I can help you with?
No thats all I called about
" have a nice day goodbye"

So maybe she can do a charge back on her charge card ? or some kind of dispute


the only thing I question is a coin really worth what someone is willing to pay? , I mean she dindt have to buy it . She was just uneducated buyer that did not research anything and went in blind folded
the coin was marked as a 55-d dd01 she could have left

So thats the part I question.

I did see that a minor 1972 dd booking out in a price guide at like $500 did $ 2000+ at a heritge auctionthe auction still sold the coin.

anymore feed back would be great , thanks

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nod2003's Avatar
United States
3294 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  11:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nod2003 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would at least look into the chargeback possibility.
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nolawyer's Avatar
United States
763 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  12:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nolawyer to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When you are dealing with somewhat informed buyers, I agree that a coin is worth what someone is willing to pay for it. But it is a completely different story when you are talking about an uneducated buyer who is relying on the seller for guidance. The guy is a con artist in my opinion.

That is why I tell my wife not to buy me coins. She is a geneticist and is extremely intelligent, but she doesn't know a thing about coins. I know she would be taken advantage of if she went to the wrong coin dealer.

It is just a shame that there are dealers like this in the Coin World, but I guess there are people like that in every trade.

I'm particularly worked up about this topic because I just bought a new car yesterday and I'm still a little annoyed with the negotiations;)
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biokemist6's Avatar
United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  12:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
" You cant go by the price guides ,a coin is worth what someone is willing to pay for it , I have sold lots of coins below price guide values and above price guide values .The price guide is just that a piece of paper with someones opinions of what a price should be...well the coin was not worth only 10-23$ the coin was worth $400 because someone paid $400"

I feel sorry that I gave this guy the benefit of the doubt, now I realize he is just a punk SOB who pulled a fast one on an old lady. Price guides are not just "a piece of paper with someone's opinion", they represent a market sales average. Obviously, some price guides are better than others but they are all based on market realities, not this guy's ripoff fantasies. Saying something is worth the price because someone was willing to pay it is a complete logical fallacy. Prices are based on what informed buyers will pay for a particular coin, not some what some random clueless person who throws their money away will pay.

As a coin dealer, he represents himself as an "expert" when dealing with the public. Non-collectors go to coin shops to receive this expert advise and do not expect to be blindly fleeced by a charlatan posing as an "expert". He was the one that said it was worth $400, who is a little old lady to question a supposed "numismatic expert"? He saw an opportunity to take advantage of someone's ignorance and he plunged his fangs into her jugular, sucking for all it was worth...


Quote:
She paid with a charge card

At least she did that, a dispute needs to be filed with the card company ASAP. Check to see if this dealer is an ANA member because he would be in violation of the Dealer Code of Ethics. Also work on filing a complaint with the local BBB. Some cages need to be rattled over this
Valued Member
jnesbitt82's Avatar
United States
191 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  1:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jnesbitt82 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sounds like its time to get serious with this guy. As stated by others, You need to involve the credit card company and file a complaint with the BBB. In addition, you might consider involving the local police. Its simple, An elderly lady entered a coin shop with intent to buy a 1955 double die for her husband. The dealer, seeing a chance to pull a fast one, decides to pull a bait and switch and the elderly lady leaves the shop with a 1955-D penny after being told by the dealer that it was the coin she wants. The item was completely misrepresented. I think legal action should be taken or he will do it again.
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chequer's Avatar
Canada
4227 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  1:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chequer to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Definitely the local BBB so others will know what they are dealing with if he won't make good on this. It's a shame, but we've all seen dealers like this and there is no place for them.
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
189673 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  2:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
the only thing I question is a coin really worth what someone is willing to pay?
This is basically true. Price guides are just guides, the actual price is always what the parties agree to at the time of sale/purchase.

However, most price guides operate with a relatively small tolerance. That is, ignoring the occasional typographical error, the price you buy/sell at is within a (relatively) small percentage of what the guides say.

Ultimately what I am saying is that $400 is not within the "margin of error" of the $10~$20 value given in the price guides. This guy is a crook, plain a simple.
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Conder101's Avatar
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  2:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Said I matched the coins discription to the current RedBook price list

As far as I know the 1955-D doubled die is not listed in the RedBook,
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
189673 Posts
 Posted 12/15/2010  2:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is not, but I doubt this dealer would have known the difference based on the conversation.

I know we only have one side to this story, but I am not liking this dealer at all.

Selling a $20 coin for $50 is one thing, but $400?
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