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Best Ways To Ship Pms

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Valued Member
chris beatie's Avatar
344 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  06:51 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add chris beatie to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hi fellas so I had a bit of a delema. I was trying to ship about 600oz of silver and everywhere I went I was getting astronomical prices for shipping+insurance.

Prices like 250 total or 300. I went to usps, ups and fedex.

What was I doing wrong? I see places like APMEX or other big online places only charge 20 or 25 for shipping on a item of similar size and value. Do they just ship it uninsured? Or am I doing it the wrong way with the wrong company?

Any advice from experience on how to safely ship cheaply is appreciated :).
Bedrock of the Community
sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  08:30 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would make a number of phone inquiries to some shipping companies with as much detail as reasonable about your particular case.

As far as possible, keep each inquiry anonymous, until you decide on which one would best serve your needs. Make very sure about the security arrangements and what compensation is available if the shipment gets mislaid.

Which agency you use will depend on:
security
tracking
dependability
guaranteed time of delivery
confirmation of arrival
compensation in case of non delivery
convenience.... (do you have to deliver to their depot or will they pick up from you, and same for the other end),

All of these things need to be considered against cost.

One of my friends shipped some rare car parts for a vintage car to Chicago recently, and they went missing. They were eventually found in a rubbish skip, and an employee was suspected, but there was not enough evidence to fire him. In this case, the car parts eventually arrived at their destination, two months late.

I am aware that costs of shipping for packages to and from the 'States in recent times have increased rapidly, but I don't know why.
Edited by sel_69l
10/09/2011 08:37 am
Valued Member
chris beatie's Avatar
344 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  10:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chris beatie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
These arnt even out of usa though its all usa to usa shipping. Somehow APMEX, Kitco, and tons of other big companies manage to ship for just 20-30 bucks I would love to know how lol.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1026 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  11:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Brucec to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
US Postal service flat rate box insured if sending from US to US.
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biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  11:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
USPS is gonna quote you the service that makes them the most money.

600 ounces of silver is around 45#, so you can ship it in one medium flat rate box for $10.95. Registered mail for $20,000 is $41.25 and signature confirmation is $2.45. That's $54.65. I like chocolate chip cookies.

I'm assuming this silver is in a compact form, like coins or bars. Get a couple of the boxes. Assemble one, leaving the top open. Repeat with the other, then cram it into the first. Put the silver in a canvas bag (the bank should have a spare or two), into the double box, including addresses in the box. Shut it with fiberglass reinforced tape, then wide brown tape. I always put HEAVY on every side near the top, so someone doesn't think it's five pounds and slip it off on their foot.

Registered mail is signed by everyone who handles it. All seams are postmarked (which is why the brown tape) to prevent tampering.
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mkfarm's Avatar
United States
667 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  11:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mkfarm to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I haven't shipped 600 oz, but I have shipped smaller amounts and USPS flat rate is probably the best way to ship. I can get a lot of coins into those boxes. I vacuum pack them them stuff them into the box when shipping junk silver coins.
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biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  11:47 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In answer to your other questions, typical loss rates at the PO is under 1 in 1000, lower yet on OOPS or Fed-Up. Both OOPS and Fed-Up have negotiated rates for volume shippers. For example, I shipped stuff to Amazon using their account, the shipping was 35% cheaper than book rate.

Similarly, bulk shippers buy insurance on their corporate policy, or self-insure. USPS insurance is the most expensive out there.
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biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  11:49 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
BTW, what you shipping?
New Member
United States
24 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  12:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add xquercus to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
600 troy ounces is over 40 pounds. Yes, that is going to be expensive to ship. Also, you want to make sure that whatever carrier you use, their insurance policy actually includes loss of bullion (if that's what you are shipping). Regular USPS insurance, for example, does not -- though they will gladly sell you the insurance anyway.

Take a look at USPS Priority Mail flat rate shipping. For insurance, ship it Registered Mail and be sure to declare the full value. You need to ship it Registered as regular USPS insurance does not include bullion. Sure, they'll sell it to you, but your claim will be denied in case of loss. A large flat rate box costs about $15 anywhere in the US. Registered mail starts at $10.75 if you are shipping something of no value and tops off at $48.25 if your declared value is $25,000. Figuring you need to insure about $20,000 worth of silver the total cost should be $15 + $42.65 (pulled from the fee schedule on the Domestic Mail Manual page 44) for a total of $57.65.

Registered mail is about as secure of a service as one can use. It's treated separately from the regular mail stream. Throughout the shipping process, packages are stored in locked containers and employees have to sign for each parcel they transfer. Unless a building burns down, there is no loss, which is why they can offer such reasonably priced insurance.

You'll need to tape all of the corners of your package with fiber reinforced paper packing tape -- the stuff that was commonly used 20 years ago and had to be wetted manually. Last roll I bought was at Staples for $8. It's for security purposes. They'll put ink seals all over your package to deter tampering.

Oh, Registered mail is also SLOW. Add 5 days at least to a cross country delivery.


Valued Member
chris beatie's Avatar
344 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  1:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chris beatie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well that definitely sounds more reasonable using the registered mail, $50 to ship is not too bad $300 to ship was redonkculous :D.

As for what it is its mostly 90% coins.

So now for registered mail I declare its full value and if it does get lost/stolen they will reimburse me right?

Ive sent way less then 1000 packages in my lifetime through usps and seen them lose many.
Valued Member
United States
302 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  3:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mmerlinn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Ive sent way less then 1000 packages in my lifetime through usps and seen them lose many.


When I worked for the USPS years ago, the local banks would send all of their bags of coins via registered mail. I am talking sealed canvas bags full of coins with no outer wrapper. There was never a problem.

EVERY USPS employee that handles the bags MUST SIGN FOR EACH AND EVERY ONE OF THEM. If they get lost, the USPS knows exactly who had them in his possession when they got lost. Needless to say, I never heard of one getting lost.

So, I would have no problem using Registered Flat Rate Priority Mail for sending large quantities of PMs. As noted above, the rates are very cheap.
Edited by mmerlinn
10/09/2011 3:04 pm
Valued Member
chris beatie's Avatar
344 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  3:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chris beatie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi MMerlin what do you mean exactly by a sealed canvas bag? I have a bunch of canvas bags with a zipper. But I got a feeling you are talking about a very specific type of bag.
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Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  6:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I just used Registered US Mail to send a package containing 50 oz. of silver bars from WA to IN. The shipping was $15.90 and the insurance was $16.05. That came to a total of $31.95. Yes, that seems expensive for this package but it's worth it to have the package properly cared for and secure along the way. I would expect to pay quite a bit more for a package 12x as large and 12x as expensive.

With all the care given to the registered mail packages, it seems a little odd that the insurance is so expensive. It's a bit more than the shipping itself. Maybe that's where the USPO is really making their money on this?

As to how APMEX, Provident, and SilverTowne can ship for much less... it is likely that they have shipping contracts for their large volume of packages that cuts the unit price by quite a bit.
Valued Member
United States
302 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2011  10:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mmerlinn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
With all the care given to the registered mail packages, it seems a little odd that the insurance is so expensive. It's a bit more than the shipping itself. Maybe that's where the USPO is really making their money on this?


The shipping cost covers normal shipping. The registration cost covers insurance plus all of the special handling needed. At least that was the way it was when I worked there. Have not looked into it since.

All registered packages MUST be under lock and key when not physically in the possession of an employee. That entails special storage space and tons of paper for the paper trail as well as more costly and slower transportation.


Quote:
Hi MMerlin what do you mean exactly by a sealed canvas bag?


They were plain canvas bags the same as what you see in the banks today. Plain canvas, open top, no fastener on the bag. The bags were sealed with a numbered lead seal which was used to track the bags much like a registration number used on normal registered mail.
Valued Member
chris beatie's Avatar
344 Posts
 Posted 10/10/2011  04:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chris beatie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
hummm I think I will just seal the bags myself somehow. Then put them in a bigger canvas bag and seal that, then put that bag in a box and seal that, then put that box in a bigger box and seal that. If they gonna tamper with all those seals itll be pretty darn obvious I would say lol.
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biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 10/10/2011  05:20 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
So now for registered mail I declare its full value and if it does get lost/stolen they will reimburse me right?


You declare the amount that you agreed to sell the silver for. There is no advantage to declaring a higher amount, since they will use proof of value.
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