Apmex Citadel

Considering how well PMs have done for the past several years and the increasing likelihood that this will continue for the next several years as well, this is looking better to me as an option.

While I have done well with my 401K plan and my IRAs, there is a double edged sword effect at work here. Yes, we do get a tax deferral with these plans and that does help to accrue more money over time. The 2nd edge comes from the fact that all of the long-term cap gains that occur in such plans are taxed as ordinary income when withdrawn in retirement. If one is in a lower tax bracket in retirement, this can still work out pretty well. If one is in a similar tax bracket, then it doesn't work so well, at least from the tax standpoint.

PMs have had substantial gains over the past dozen years. PMs are usually taxed at a 28% collectibles rate when sold. If PMs were owned in a Roth IRA, however, there would be no tax due on possibly some very substantial gains. That could make figuring this all out very worthwhile.

If any of the money is a Roth use that first to avoid the tax. I don't know your exact age but if you're past the 59 1/2b age I would just take a withdrawal that wouldn't have that great of a tax hit and be done with it and do it yearly in the beginning of the year so as to have the funds avail to buy on dips. I just like to have my Pms. Just never know. Always think of MF Global and how it was an old established stable company until GS Corzine took over. Terrible last 2 governors in NJ

Not to get too philosophical here, but that sounds an awful like the famous "Pascal's Wager" argument for believing in God. Basically, the argument states that if you believe in God (and, of course do all the things that God tells you to do) and it turns out God doesn't exist, you are no worse off. On the other hand, if God does exist, you will reap eternal benefits for believing and receive eternal punishment for not believing. So, the argument goes, it's better to believe and do what God says just in case he exists.

One of the big fallacies with this argument, however, is the lost opportunity costs. It's simply not true to say that "belief costs nothing," since there's actually a lot of sacrifice involved in trying to do everything that God has [supposedly] asked of us. Going to church regularly, ministering to the needy, resisting all sorts of temptation that you would otherwise enjoy doing, etc., etc., etc. You might actually be pretty upset if you found out it had all been for nothing in the end.

Same thing with disaster preparation. Moving large amounts of cash into PM makes sense in hindsight if there is a disaster, but if the economy eventually picks up and PM prices plummet as a result, you may find yourself with a whole lot of shiny metal and not enough money to actually take care of you and yours in your retirement years. Because true disaster preparedness isn't just a matter of going through the motions and buying a little bit of PM here and there. If you REALLY believe we are headed for a disaster and want to survive it, you pretty much have to be willing to convert most (if not all) of your cash into things like PM, real estate, food storage, guns, etc.

Now, don't get me wrong -- I'm not saying there won't be a disaster or that we shouldn't all prepare for it. I acknowledge that there certainly could be one coming and agree that we'll be better off if we are prepared for it if it comes. I just think it's a little disingenuous to say that there is "no harm" in preparing for the worst if the worst never comes, since truly preparing for the worst is going to require sacrificing a lot of things that I would otherwise spend my hard earned time and money on.

Another argument against Pascal's Wager is that his wager assumes that we know what God is "really" like and that he really would reward people for believing in him. What if God is nothing like what we imaging him to be and, say, actually hates people who follow like sheep and rewards rebellion? If that were the case, anybody who does everything they are told to do would be punished and those who think for themselves would be rewarded.

Similarly, what if there is a disaster, but not the type we are preparing for? Let's say, for example, I take all my money and covert it to PM which I store in an ultra secure vault under my house with guard dogs, alarm systems, etc. And then a sink hole opens up and it all gets sucked into the earth. Or I let a company like APMEX manage it and they turn out to be Enron-style crooks and all my silver mysteriously disappears.

Again, I'm not saying that preparing for disaster is a bad thing, but I think we have to acknowledge that are risks in doing so. It's just a matter of trying to figure out which risks are more likely and acting accordingly.

And yes, I was a philosophy major in my undergraduate days, why do you ask?

If you can't hold it, it ain't yours.

Size don't matter. Look at the mega-businesses that have folded.

You're safer with a guy storing $10,000 for others than the guy storing $1 billion. A billion is worth stealing, internally or externally.

If SHTF, communications and transportation will likely be affected. What good is PM a thousand miles away then?

edit to fix typos.

I've always gotten a kick out of the fact that we have millions of laws to enforce the Ten Commandments (or any other religion's equivalent), which in turn are unnecessary if you follow the Golden Rule.

Ed,

I was born in Delaware. The reason the silver companies are there is the same reason every single major US bank has an office in DE: the state is considered one of, if not the most, business friendly state in the Union. Another interesting fact: we were also the first state to ratify the US Constitution out of the original thirteen colonies. But I've moved on from my birthplace and now live in Oregon, after spending a few all-too-dry years in Arizona. The west is the best ;)

$425,000 eguals 1/2 a monster box in the safe bolted to the concrete wall in the basement.

You would really rather have unknown people, even from a reputable company, storing your unseen gold in an unknown location.