Do You Like Mechanical Double And Why?

As coffeegod said the original post mainly wanted to know how many like Mechanical Double and why? In way to many posts people just want to know the basics, not the values. Regardless I've just got to go along with coffeegod. What some people think is junk, others find this is what they wanted for a long time. At a local flea market there is a person I know that sells only items he finds in the garbage. I mean the stuff people throw out. And he does sell this so called garbage. If you watch the Antique Road Show you would see so many times people with items worth a lot of money they found in the garbage as JUNK.

Coppercoins I know it irritates you no end about such things as minor perfections in coins. I've also heard you mention how little money there is in your position. Maybe if you'ld join the people that want to buy JUNK as a error or maybe just a novelty, you too could make a lot of money. Like I've said at coin shows such items as you describe as JUNK does sell. ebay has the audience of millions and millions and if those millions want minor error coins, then they will buy them regardless of anyone stating they are JUMK or not.

As Biokemist6 stated it is not the dealers that make the prices. In reality to a degree it is. If numerous dealers all want $5 for a very slight offset, then many people think that is what it is worth. majority rules.
As a coin collector of well over 60 years I have put back into circulation many, many coins that today I see selling at coin shows.

At one time an Edsel Auto was a joke. Today an Edsel Convertible sells for about $100,000. Nice joke.
OH, one more thing coffeegod, I don't like Fords. I'm a Mopar person.

Okay, so the thread did get a little hijacked. I was in no way responding to the original poster of the thread. I was replying to one person's comments about selling Machine Doubling by the roll at a premium...I saw red. It's easy to do when I see myself as an educator trying to tell people day and night not to buy the junk, find it in your change - it's easy. BUY the stuff you don't see every day. Buy the good stuff and leave the other stuff to the weekend roll searches.

Like I said before, I never called anyone out for collecting Machine Doubling. I call them out for selling it like it has some market value. It DOES NOT...simply put. Anyone who charges over normal value for a coin just because it has Machine Doubling is misrepresenting what they are selling. Point blank, end of story. Whether intended or not, it is misrepresentation and SHOULD BE STOPPED.

See me as being arrogant if you like. I'm trying to teach people and save them from making mistakes. Sorry if that's arrogance. Meanwhile we have people right here on this board fighting against ME for teaching people that collecting true errors and varieties has merit...they have value...they are scarce. Collecting little die chips and Machine Doubling, while it may rock the boat for some people, does NOT have VALUE just because someone sells them to someone else who doesn't know what they are buying.

COUNTLESS times people....countless....I have seen little old ladies and kids selling their dead loved-one's collections thinking they were going to be able to pay for the funeral with the collection - just to find out their dead relative saved clad Kennedy half dollars and buckets of circulated wheat cents. The dead one never got the education they needed to make wise choices and buy the right stuff that actually WOULD have a chance of gaining value.

I have seen binder after binder after binder full of crap...die chips, die cracks, Machine Doubling and other worthless stuff with thousand dollar price tags on the holders. And it simply breaks my heart to see someone who never cared about coins to try cashing in on the "valuable collection" just to get $50 for it. It's a simple two-headed point...

1. People NEED to either work toward collecting coins with value, or at least tell the family they'll never get over face for it. DO NOT die and leave your family thinking your books full of die cracks are going to bring them anything over face value....because they WON'T, and all you're going to do is leave heirs scratching their heads wondering why you wasted your life away on nothing.

2. If you want to collect the stuff worth money and simply don't have the money to start off with the 1955 doubled die, DO NOT buy a 1955 cent with Die Deterioration and put it in your collection and consider it done. Work toward it. Work for a nice collection. The challenge and the time it takes is half the fun. QUIT saving stupid little common machine doubled slugs because they "substitute" for the more valuable doubled dies. GET OUT THERE AND LOOK FOR THEM! I started this when I was 11 years old. I found my first doubled die when I was that age - a 1939 nickel DDR. I knew right away when I saw it that it was something special. I learned at the age of 11-12 what a doubled die was, and what the other non-collectible doubling was. It's not that hard, people...I could tell the difference at 12! I have since searched through over a million coins, and have about a thousand different 'keepers' to speak for it. Yeah, about one in a thousand coins is worth keeping...the rest are JUNK! I now have a collection worth around $100K, most of which I FOUND. I have never been rich, I've always been dirt poor. Until this year I NEVER made over $25K per year. I NEVER had a "coin budget" - I scratches through pocket change for 30 years, bought left-over wheat bags, bought $1-$2 BU rolls of memorials and built up what I have. It's NOT easy, and NOT going to happen over night.

ANYONE can do it, but NOBODY is going to do it saving die cracks, house fire coins, and corroded cents. You HAVE to learn what's valuable - those are the challenging finds. The non-valuable stuff is not challenging to find - at all. That's why it has no value. And believe me...when you find that challenging coin--when you finally hit the jackpot, the euphoria is worth it. I have stories, just ask about them.

Look...I'm not here to police what people are collecting...but if you're into collecting machine doubled coins, you are MISSING THE POINT in collecting doubling. I cannot say it any clearer. You really need to either learn what's valuable and start looking for the truly collectible, or at least make sure your family and friends know what you're doing is a waste of time if they plan to pay for your funeral with your coins.

I posted and then I deleted it. same territory different day.

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Look...I'm not here to police what people are collecting...but if you're into collecting machine doubled coins, you are MISSING THE POINT in collecting doubling. I cannot say it any clearer. You really need to either learn what's valuable and start looking for the truly collectible, or at least make sure your family and friends know what you're doing is a waste of time if they plan to pay for your funeral with your coins.

Anyone, please raise your hands if you began collecting as a way of life. This is supposed to be fun! IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MISSING THE POINT. It has EVERYTHING to do with personal likeness.

If someone finds anything significant to themselves throughout life, then that significance becomes priceless to that person. If someone likes the color blue & you tell them that it's completely pointless to like the color blue because green is better, thats called pacification by force. I personally collect because I enjoy it. This is how it's supposed to be..... an enjoyable hobby.

If the market is changing do to inexperienced sellers/buyers or what ever, then we who sell true DDs/error type coins or whatever need to be more forthright & aggressive in our description of directing the market to what we want. Nothing happens if all we do is sit around on a forum and BS about it & get pissy at each others own personal thoughts & differences.

Yinzi50, my biggest advice to you is........ collect what you enjoy. You know what you like. You know what is important to you. If you think a certain MD is significant to you, then you have by all rights to keep that coin. Do not let anyone tell you that it's junk, if you like it, then that's all that matters. You are not wasting your time if you call it a hobby and learn from what you have.

There is no MISSING THE POINT, except to those who forgot what it was like to be a kid again & collect innocently.

I'm through replying to this topic unless it's going to be straight old fashion civilized non-personaly directed education. I'm sure others will post comments about it some more.

Copper, you've tried to make your point as aggressively as you can. You've made the MISSING THE POINT comment as many times as needed. We, at least I understood before this topic your personal greivance toward MDs & such. I don't think as many people are MISSING THE POINT as you think. Money drives our daily lives. It's been done before & will be done until the end of time.......people will try to make money for what they want any way they can, even if it means corrupting what we believe & don't believe in. This include selling MDs to the un-witting.
Eric

About 4 or more Coin shows coming up in April. Think I'll go sell all my MD's there.

I personally like and collect MD coins as long as they have a significant shelf doubling on them and not just a hard to see minor "Doubling". I also know that they have no value, except face, for them. I also like and collect coins with die cracks which I know have no real value unless the crack is major ie. it looks like the die is shattered or split in half. Even then I know that die cracks like that the premium is usually not much. There are other types of coins that I collect that have no true collector value but I like them so I collect them. Coins are a hobby to me not an investment vehicle. I do collect some coins with value but value is not what determines if I keep something or not. I keep my normal coins ie. Morgans, Walkers and other coins and my true error/variety coins with real value separate from my worthless die cracks, MDD's and other minor oddities. I have made sure that my family knows that the binders with the worthless coins are just that. And after my passing the coins in them should just be dumped out of the binder page pockets and rolled and spent, if nobody in the family wants them. They also know that the other coins have value and should be treated as such. Keeping the valuable coins separate from the coins that the only value over face is my enjoyment will help them when I am gone. I think everyone that collects should make sure that family knows the difference as that will make it much easier on them when the time comes. So in my opinion, and it is just an opinion, you should collect what you enjoy both valuable and worthless but be sure that your family knows what is what.

Chuck is right in the fact that you can find MD everywhere. However, I do like to collect them if they are severe examples, and yes I would pay a little more for one if it was to my liking. I would not pay a DD price for one, or even close to that.

Uneducated collectors are flooding the market, and paying too high of prices for some of these coins, but that is just the School of Hard Knocks. People need to research anything before they buy and that includes coins. If they pay too much for a coin, it's their own fault. People who take advantage of these uneducated buyers are committing fraud and should be prosecuted.

I have noticed that whenever there is an argument on the forums, there are two people that are always the ones instigating or provoking it. You may be the experts, but arguing your point in the way you do, only creates an unpleasant atmosphere here. I value your opinions, but it only needs to be given once.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

This is supposed to be a place where we can come with questions without being assaulted. Members here range from novice to expert and that needs to be taken into consideration. This is a hobby and it is supposed to be enjoyed. Your arguing is taking that enjoyment away, please take that into consideration before you reply with heated remarks.

As far as selling these junk "errors" (ex. 1993 Cent with MD), if you started the bid at face value, and the competing bidders bidded up to $5.00, then you shouldn't feel like you ripped anyone off. Of course, as long as you stated in the description that this is a common MD and not a true error. Apparantly, some people do like MDs and are willing to pay for them, so let 'em.
(As far as shipping charges go, that's a whole different story!)