Coin Community Family of Web Sites Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors
Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes. Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer 300,000 items to help build your collection! Specializing in Modern Numismatics Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall Royal Estate Auctions - $1 Coin Auctions








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

Can Someone Help ID Abbasid Dirhams?

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 5 / Views: 6,570Next Topic  
Valued Member
j_hewes's Avatar
United States
52 Posts
 Posted 05/26/2014  10:46 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add j_hewes to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I have 3 old Iraqi dirhams I bought recently at auction. The best I have been able to accomplish so far is that they are from the Abbasid dynasty.

Comparing with Google images, I found many matches for the obverses, but the reverses always seem different one way or the other. Needless to say, I cannot read a bit of Arabic or Persian.

Any help narrowing these down in time period and/or ruler would be greatly appreciated.

John


Can-Someone-Help-ID-Abbasid-Dirhams?

Can-Someone-Help-ID-Abbasid-Dirhams?

Can-Someone-Help-ID-Abbasid-Dirhams?
Moderator
Learn More...
Sap's Avatar
Australia
16859 Posts
 Posted 05/27/2014  07:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I can't read Arabic either, but let me break out my copy of Richard Plant's book, "Arabic coins and how to read them" and see if I can help.

The top coin struck in Baghdad in AH 298 (which converts to AD 910-911), during the reign of caliph al-Muqtadir. Here's a similar coin in the zeno.ru database.

The middle coin is dated AH 140 (AD 757-758), making it a dirham of the caliph al-Mansur. I think the mint is Basra, though that's the hardest part of the legend to read on this coin. Zeno.ru example.

The third coin is more or less the same as the first, except I believe the year is AH 302. Zeno.ru example.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
Petrus's Avatar
Belgium
2895 Posts
 Posted 05/27/2014  5:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petrus to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
you are right SAP.
Here are some pictures of these kind of coins (scroll down please : Abbasid)
http://www.chiefacoins.com/Database...ies/Iraq.htm
with explanation of the writing
Valued Member
j_hewes's Avatar
United States
52 Posts
 Posted 05/27/2014  11:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add j_hewes to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you, Sap and Petrus, for your quick response and sharp eyes!

Of course, a question answered often spawns further questions...

Where on these coins do I even find the date? I can see nothing (even in the much clearer zeno.ru examples) that remotely looks like modern Arabic numerals.

And for that matter, did the Abbasids write in Arabic, or Persian, or some other Semitic-type language?

John
Moderator
Learn More...
Sap's Avatar
Australia
16859 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2014  12:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The language is Arabic. The script is not the modern, flowing "Naskhi" script typically used to write Arabic today; when these coins were made, that had not been invented yet. The script on these coins is called "Kufic", and is much harder to read even for a native Arabic speaker as many of the letters look more or less identical.

Also not yet invented were "Arabic numerals", a concept which was invented in India and did not enter the Islamic world until parts of India were conquered. The numbers comprising the date on these coins are written out, in full; as if this year's AD date were written as "two thousand and fourteen". On all three coins, the date can be found on the innermost circular legend on the obverse (left, left and right sides of your coins, respectively) from around 5 o'clock backwards up to around 1 o'clock. Some time ago I did up a translation graphic for an earlier Umayyad coin, which has much the same principles as your coins with regard to the date:

Can-Someone-Help-ID-Abbasid-Dirhams?

Plant's book is invaluable in reading Kufic date-words, as it shows what each numeral-word is supposed to look like and some of the variations of those words that can be found on the actual coins of the period.

Hope this helps.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
Pillar of the Community
shanew's Avatar
Australia
1041 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2014  05:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add shanew to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
sap what does your book shelf look like have you a city library in your house
  Previous TopicReplies: 5 / Views: 6,570Next Topic  

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.23 seconds to rattle this change. Forums