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 Replies: 220 / Views: 41,339 |
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Valued Member
Australia
369 Posts |
To get back to the original posters question I have received my four coins that I submitted 2 weeks ago today. Overall I am happy with the grades and the service. They are harsh graders but Australian standards are high so no problem there. I don't give a tinkers toss where the plastic is made and would recommend them to anyone. I don't particularly like slabbed coins because the one's I have seen by american TPG's are, in my opinion, overgraded. If the case starts cracking or the coins start turning black i'll let you know, but I'm satisfied everything is ok. |
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Valued Member
Australia
315 Posts |
Finally we are back onto the topic. Quote:
To get back to the original posters question I have received my four coins that I submitted 2 weeks ago today 2 week turnaround, well that's pretty good Quote:
They are harsh graders but Australian standards are high so no problem there. That can be a good and bad thing. Bad for the seller, good for the buyer. Quote:
I don't give a tinkers toss where the plastic is made and would recommend them to anyone I couldn't help but laugh over that, well said. Quote: I don't particularly like slabbed coins because the one's I have seen by american TPG's are, in my opinion, overgraded. This is a problem, actually a very big problem for novice collectors think that buying a AU-53 coin means that they are buying a aUNC coin. This is obviously very much incorrect as most members know in this forum. |
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Valued Member
Australia
444 Posts |
QUOTE FROM AIRGEM If the case starts cracking or the coins start turning black i'll let you know, but I'm satisfied everything is ok.why dont you highlight this part from airgems post COINSAUS and tell us about your guaranteed buyback , OH thats right you cant mention or do not have a guaranteed buy back and if I was you I would not mention one either , because there are people on this forum just waiting for you to say you buy back , so some of us can send your no grade / cleaned / doctored rubbish coins which you graded buy the way back for a refund and we will even use the macdonalds guide to work out a buy back price
Edited by PNC king
07/21/2014 06:56 am
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
Quote:
This is a problem, actually a very big problem for novice collectors think that buying a AU-53 coin means that they are buying a aUNC coin. This is obviously very much incorrect as most members know in this forum. I would think that by now most Australian collectors are aware of the way a Sheldon grade equates to the ANDA grading system (Even Me)Due in NO small part to this and other forums educating collectors on Exactly how these grades "Cross reference" When APCGS first started out they Not only "Cloned" their name but also (In Vain) tried to grade using the Sheldon system without having a clue of how it worked, Thus the MS35 type grades. As this is a family orientated site I cannot and will not say what I think of this shabby basement slabber and its supporters (Paid or otherwise). |
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Valued Member
Australia
75 Posts |
There are large similarities between the terms and conditions on the apcgs and NNC websites:
apcgs
• APCGS USES THERE PROFESSIONAL OPINION IN GRADING ALL COINS. APCGS MAKES NO WARRANTY OR REPRESENTATION AND SHALL HAVE NO LIABILITY WHATSOEVER TO THE CUSTOMER FOR THE GRADE ASSIGNED BY APCGS TO ANY COIN.
NNC
SUBJECTIVITY OF GRADING. Limitation of Liability for Grading. All parties understand and agree that the professional opinion required in grading coins involves NNC's subjective judgement. Consequently, NNC makes no warranty or representation and shall have no liability whatsoever to the customer for the grade assigned by NNC to any coin.
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Valued Member
Australia
75 Posts |
apcgs
• ALL PARTIES AGREE THAT
(a) APCGS's LIABILITY FOR COINS LOST OR DAMAGED WILL BE LIMITED TO
(I) DAMAGES CAUSED BY APCGS INCURRED WHILE THE COIN IS ACTUALLY IN THE PHYSICAL POSSESSION OF APCGS, (SPECIFICALLY EXCLUDING ANY DAMAGE INCURRED BY SHIPPING)
AND
(II) THE AMOUNT OF DAMAGES WILL BE LIMITED TO THE TRUE VALUE OF THE COIN AND NOT BASED UPON ANY INSURED VALUE; AND
(b) APCGS SHALL HAVE NO LIABILITY WHATSOEVER TO PARTY OR PERSON FOR ANY DAMAGES OR INJURIES RESULTING IN THE REMOVAL OF ANY COIN OUT OF ITS SLAB HOLDER.
(c) APCGS ASSUMES NO LIABILITY, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, FOR COINS SEALED BY APCGS THAT ARE MISHANDLED OR TREATED BY THE OWNER IN A MANNER THAT RESULTS IN DAMAGE OF THE SLAB HOLDER. TONING ON A COIN IS A RESULT OF NATURAL OXIDATION AND IS CAUSED BY MATERIALS IN THE COIN REACTING TO ENVIRONMENTAL CONDITIONS. APCGS IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR NATURAL TONING.
NNC
LIMITATION OF LIABILITY FOR COIN DAMAGE. All parties agree that (
a) NNC's liability for coins lost or damaged will be limited to
(I) damages caused by National Numismatic Certification incurred while the coin is actually in the physical possession of National Numismatic Certification, LLC., (specifically excluding any damage incurred by shipping)
and
(II) the amount of damages will be limited to the true value of the coin and not based upon any insured value; and
(b) NNC shall have no liability whatsoever to any party or person for any damages or injuries resulting [/b]from removing the coin from the NNC holder
(c) National Numismatic Certification assumes no liability, express or implied, for coins sealed by NNC that are mishandled or treated by the owner in a manner that results in damage to......
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Valued Member
Australia
75 Posts |
apcgs
• THE CUSTOMER AGREES TO INSPECT ALL COINS UPON RECEIPT AND REPORT ANY DAMAGES OR DISCREPANCY TO APCGS WITHIN FIVE (5) BUSINESS DAYS OF CUSTOMER'S RECEIPT OF COINS. FAILURE TO PROPERLY INSPECT, IDENTIFY AND REPORT THE DISCREPANCY OR ERROR TO APCGS WITHIN 5 DAYS OF CUSTOMER RECEIPT OF THE COIN WILL MAKE THE CUSTOMER/SUBMITTER FINANCIALLY LIABLE FOR ANY AND ALL LOSSES AND/OR CLAIMS CAUSED BY THE CIRCULATION OR SALE OF THE MISMARKED OR INAPPROPRIATELY IDENTIFIED COIN.
NNC
INSPECTION. The customer agrees to inspect all coins immediately upon receipt and report any damage or discrepancy to National Numismatic Certification, LLC. within five (5) business days of customer's receipt of coins. Failure to properly inspect, identify and report the discrepancy or error to NNC within 5 days of customer receipt of the coin will make the customer/submitter financially liable for any and all losses and/or claims caused by the circulation or sale of the mismarked or inappropriately identified coin.
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Valued Member
Australia
75 Posts |
Some remarkable similarities.
The word that springs to mind is plagiarism.
Not surprising as it has been noted that the business model of apcgs is that of NNC.
Edited by agent86
07/22/2014 12:13 am
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
674 Posts |
Nice detective work.!!  |
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Valued Member
Australia
315 Posts |
You should read PCGS terms and might find that most of the TPG companies pretty much use the same. Does NNC even exist anymore? I had a look at their website and they were talking about holiday closures in 2010 so I guess they are extinct. Edited by coinsaus
07/22/2014 03:37 am
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Valued Member
Australia
444 Posts |
i think NNC have relocated to australia under the banner of APCGS coinsaus the similarities are too close to be a coincidence , GREAT WORK AGENT 86 to uncover the truth
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
852 Posts |
In another section of the NNC website they list the public holidays for 2008. Not very good at updating their site 2008-10 (or to date).
I have read that the guy who ran that company was an excellent grader who I guess cashed in (went to the dark side).
I have at least a dozen NNC slabs, purchased them cheaply (around gold value)for 200+ year old Ottoman coins.
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
852 Posts |
Dig some digging and saw the SEC filings for Collectors Universe (parent company of PCGS) thanks to another CCF poster.
PCGS owns the dies used to make their slabs and has 2 suppliers make the slabs for them. The new security feature (Dupont Izon) is licenced. Both those facts make it hard for counterfeiters to make the fakes either in a back alley or on another line in the same factory as the real ones (detection of "foreign orders" would cost them contracts and licences).
The SEC filings detail a number of risks (disclosure requirements) and it doesn't list under risks anything that would imply the 2 suppliers are outside the US (currency fluctuation risks, international transportation risks, IP risks, political/geopolitical risks etc).
Safe to say the PCGS slabs are US made.
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Moderator
 Australia
16830 Posts |
Quote:
Does NNC even exist anymore? I had a look at their website and they were talking about holiday closures in 2010 so I guess they are extinct. NNC never really attempted to even pretend to be a TPG, in the sense of accepting submissions from outside. They were established to satisfy just one customer: the ebay seller known as centsles. A very typical "basement slabber", just a lot bigger - and longer-lasting - than most. I suspect whatever tiny amount of non-centsles customers NNC might have had, dried up completely when ebay established their "top tier slabs only" rule. Centsles still sells only NNC-slabbed coins - as you can see from their feedback page - so they're still going. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Valued Member
Australia
444 Posts |
great post SAP , I cant wait for ebay aust to set up a top tier slabs only policy , that would certainly get rid of the rubbish TPG out there , we need to get rid of these cancerous rubbish TPG before they spread Edited by PNC king
07/23/2014 04:49 am
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Replies: 220 / Views: 41,339 |
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Posted 07/21/2014 02:53 am
