"Usa Act" May Kill Penny, Nickel & $1 Bill

Funny, last time I spent halves in Arbys, the cashier had never seen them and asked where he could get some. He was probably in his early 20s.

Spent pres $ at a grocery store once and the girl was amazed at them because she had never seen them as called her manager over to buy a few from the till right there and several customers behind me asked id they could have them for change if there is any left (it was about 50 so I am sure there was plenty for all).

Who turns their nose up at these coins? Many people have never seen them simply because BUSINESSES refuse to order them from bank to use as change and instead get the bills. Unless you are a CRHer and order a box from a bank, the odds of you finding a dollar coin in many areas is slim to none.

Just go read the project $100k thread with all the stories of how spending halves and any dollar coin gets some strange reaction from people that don't even know they are money, or surprise from people that haven't seen them or even know they still make them!

Some people just don't understand this.




See case in point. The banks don't use them because many people don't even know you can ask for them. First time I got a box of pennies for CRH, the teller gave me the list of every box and bag available of the coin types. $1 coins come in $1000 boxes, and they don't order them because the businesses don't order them. The bank only orders boxes it needs or businesses need in order to cash checks or give change. You want the banks to have them? GET BUSINESSES TO USE THEM FOR CHANGE!

Any odd currency you find in a bank like the dozen $2 bills I got yesterday is because someone brought them in and deposited them or paid a loan or something with them.

For those who missed it thus far in any of these "get rid of the penny" type things: Banks only order coins and currency that their customers ask for. Their biggest customers are businesses. Some banks will special order coins for John Q Public off the street, some you have to have an account, others you have to have a business account to get them. IT varies based on the branch manager at EACH individual bank.

You wold have to force businesses to use dollar coins in order to get the banks to have them in larger supply, and the only way to do that is to discontinue the dollar bill. BUSINESSES MUST ADOPT new money for it to become mainstream use.Businesses jsut want quick and easy for management, but will make EVERYTHING hard or impossible for the customer. This means they don't want to change the money they use, and they will change their placement of items in the store 2 times a week to make the customer have to "browse" more things and possibly impulse buy more items.

So many people sayin things they have no idea about because the either don't understand the system, or are out of touch with the people that use it, like politicians that put everything on a credit/debit card or write a check and don't realize that not everyone has those things and still use money. People will adapt quicker to the dollar coin than the loss of the nickel or penny for those that MUST use money. Those that use plastic just don't even get how large that population that use money is.

"We the People" is right, but the problem is we don't really have a representative government, because those doing the governing are out of touch with "we", "the people"!




Tell the places you shop to give them as change if they have them. odds are they are instantly taken to the "office" to get out of the way of other money. If you are geting moeny at the bank, you are allowed to ask for it in the number of and denomination of your choice.

I took 5 $1000 bills today for grocery and cigs budget, as well as every $2 bill they had. Have you ever asked for dollar coins at the bank? If you don't ask, they do not default to hand them to you. The moment you ask, you will find many willing to give you all they have, which can be several hundred dollars worth so be ready for that! Go to the bank tomorrow and jsut tell them you would like to buy some dollar coins off of them with whatever bill you wish to get "changed". If they haven't already been bought out by a CHRer, then I am sure you will find you get a few or more.




You don't come from the government then because there the rule and saying is:




So if it costs about a cent, and there is no "profit" then that is close enough. The problem with the cent is that it is 45% of the Mint yearly production. That shows there is a profit, because someone has to order the coins from the FED or whatever, that has them which means that business is out that amount of money and the coins go out and thus the FED or whatever now has actually money and income from the sale of those coins. until the FED releases them, they are not money and worth 0. when the digital transfer of funds get into FED possession it can then go form the bank who got it from people to pay FED, BEP, USMint personnel etc and those bonds or whatever that are US loan to pay other countries.

if that isn't the "profit" then it is just creating more money for the increase in number of people in the US that it supplies money to, meaning there is more money which is a profit to US citizens and territories to prevent things like the 2009 TARP nonsense where the government got scammed.

If the government is interested in saving billions of taxpayer dollars, then why does it still contract and pay things like $400 for toilets in government installations that last no longer than the $100 toilet you can get off the shelf at Lowes/Home Depot/etc?

They pay 400% the cost of the thing for a toilet, and can't pay 241% the cost of a penny? COME ON!

I just in no way shape or form feel you should get rid of your ones place. Math say, NO! nickel. my opinion on whether it should exist ranges from "meh" to "whatever". So long as the quarter exists you need something that makes 5 cents in order to make 30 or 80 cents change and such. I feel the nickel should be cut, again, because you don;t get rid of your ones place. Math needs it. I know MANY people fear math (not you that I know of, but many out there do), but you just start counting with 1, and it works that way for a reason.

keep the penny at 2.41 cents each and lose the nickel at 11.14 cents each. Jefferson would probably be happy to be removed from the non-decimal coin since he strove for the decimal system. $1, 10 cents, 1 cent. those are the coins he wanted. Those are the ones we need. Removing any of those I will fight simply because MATH! I accept he nickel and quarter, but those are the two we dont need. Half, I just like then cause they are the only real coin-sized coin we have left. Everything else looks like a Putt-Putt token (quarter) or a bus token (nickel, quarter), or a washer (nickel, penny)

IF profit was not in consideration, then why would it matter how much the coin costs to make, so long as it is needed? Did we need 112 new quarter designs after 1998? I get the 2009 cents being a bicentennial, but exactly why do we have the West Journey ones?

Toss out the nickel and quarter. and people will have plenty of dimes and pennies to give exact change with and you would nee LESS coins to run a cash register. As I have been CHRing I have been keeping loose track of the change I get back and the most used coins TO ME, this is subjective analysis, are:

1. penny
2. quarter
3. dime
4. nickel

I still say we don't need the quarter. dimes will do, they are just so small they are a PITA. We got rid of the Half Cent, why do we still have the b*****d cousin of the half-disme?

Nickel need to go.

I also agree with whoever said it to get rid of the "kings of the US" from coins. Bills too! Why change the quarter, because it and the one have George on it. We know who he is and we know he didn't want to be a king and didn't want to be on money, but there he is, against HIS will.

"life, liberty, pursuit of happiness", his freedom of choice was laughed at and it was done anyway. get him off of there! the commemorative pres dollars, sure that is fine, but when over, get rid of George from money since he didn't want to be George the 1st. dollar bill and quarter should GO AWAY! Thank you George, we don't need you anymore, you did your job for us, and we appreciate it, now rest in piece. (well we might need him to get rid of the current 1700 England monarchies that run the US now but that is a different stony all together.)

why is the quarter never mentioned? Maybe we can get lucky and after the ATB, they are gone. congrats you have your collector item of US history memorabilia, now get rid of them as money!

See, this is what dumbfounds me the most, they just changed the design, and then want to get rid of them both? The dollar bill they haven't changed the design with all the new security features, so it seems more likely that it would go in favor fo the billions of dollar coins stockpiled from 2009~2012.

Why bother with shield cents and "return to monticello" just to get rid of them? It would have made more sense to have had those bicentennial issues be a send-off for the coin. 200 would have marked the end of the cent and 2005 would have marked the end of the nickel. the half dollar this morning I spent the lady asked me "What are you giving me here?" She has seen the gold dollars, $2 bill, and everything except the half recently. She thought they stopped making them then. Which brings me to the idea that it would have been a good send-off for the nickel and cent. Now they should wait for some reason other than ""WAAAAAH! to get rid of them.

There has been less cents per year made of the shield cent, sometimes one fourth as many, as there was most years of the lincoln memorial cents. (zilcolns included) Obviously a large chunk of them are not needed anymore due to people using plastic and it being accepted more readily than a check and people not needing change.

I just want to see the study data, because I have the ability to do math and think for myself and despise when some politician tries to treat me like I am dumb and thinks I don't understand things like this. Until data is released on the REAL reasons and not just some knee-jerk reaction, I just can't see a reason to get rid of the cent. Again, it is the ones place you begin counting from. People in this country are bad enough at math as it is, than to throw them this curve!

The quarters, ATB, are sold and only cost 11.14 cents to make. a roll of quarters is $10 face.

That $10 roll costs $4.46 to make. That already is a profit of $5.54 per roll o ATB sent out to banks. But banks aren't the only ones that get them They are sold in mint sets, and other weird ways, one is a Mint Roll for $18.95 BEFORE S&H.

18.95-4.46=$14.49 per roll the mint takes in on EACH Mint Roll sold. THIS is why the state and ATB Quarters were made, to give people MORE reason to buy normal business strikes for much more than face value.

lets just say the mint takes in 13.86 per ATB issued in 2001. 97 million in face was made of ATBs (reported) that cost 43 million to make, for a profit of 54 million.

you and anyone else should NOT be just looking at the cent because the cent is not the ONLY coin the mint makes in the year. the mint issuing all the coins made in 2011 took in 4300 million over cost.

you tell me any business in this country that only has 2 (since San Fran and West Point aren't included as the cost to make those coins are not available) locations would sneeze at $300 million dollars?

2.31 cents is what the mint reports the cost of each cent in 2011, this must be after all costs including equipment depreciation, repair costs, making dies, paying employees, etc. it is NOT the reported cost of just the blanks as THEY make the blanks from the sandwiches that one company sends them to make coins from.

you cannot just bandy shipping without any details and have me expect the mint ships coins for free. USPS (not a government agency) doesn't ship anything for free. UPS/FedEx doesn't either. Someone somewhere pays for the shipping costs, unless you have documentation stating the FRB/BEP/US Mint ships things out for free.

People dispose of the cent, but it is NOT disposable. the nickel is disposable as is all other non-decimal coinage. the nickel costs 223.6% of face to make, the cent 241% over face. darn close if you ask me, and you can always have 9 cents if you didn't throw them away. People too lazy and only wanting to carry 2 nickels, then why do they even have change in their pockets?



Really? Every cashier I speak to about this says it is dumb, how will they make change, why would they want to round to a dime?

Many people will notice they are gone. The funny thing even looking at that "45%" comment is that it is not even counting the half dollars. in 2011, both half and dollar coins were NIFC, meaning you had to pay the premium to get them from the Mint or you CHR them or buy singles, which means that $300 million profit is a lowball number.

$32.95 for a $25 roll that cost $4.51 to make. $28.44 profit per roll. that means they got the cost back and still made a roll of dollar coins worth from them! (and a roll of nickels and 2 rolls of pennies face as well!)

let's assume the rolls were what sold most since we don't know really how many bags sold vs rolls.

$1.14 was made (after costs) for each of the 374,920,000 dollar coins (pre$+SAC)made in 2011.

$426,546,484 "profit" on the dollar coins not just $307,321,924. that makes the income $400 million not the original 300 just basing it on face value - cost!

Again this doesn't include the crazy prices for proofs and such which MUST be figured into the US Mint earnings and budgets. $14.95 for clad proof quarters worth $1.25 face.

The math doesn't lie, unlike the politicians! (They are just too old to do math anymore!)

Waste spending by the government is done in many more places that would save 10 times what this proposed thing would save if politicians expenditure budgets for frivolous nonsense was cut!

Again, the math doesn't lie! does the "USA Act" have a senator or congressman salry increase anywhere in it like most other bills and such do? When was the last time they took a pay-cut?

This all jsut sounds like another TARP funds scheme where the people running the scheme get fat bonuses at the taxpayer expense with nothing actually given back to the taxpayer.

either show me some numbers and a .gov website to view them on, or I am not buying it that the cent cannot be afforded to be made anymore.

Again math doesn't lie, we start counting at 1, not 10. the moment the US drops the penny it will be like Japan where the Yen is 360 to the US dollar, but the US dollar will be 360 to something like the Euro.

How many countries have removed their smallest ones place and still have comparable currency? How well is it really working for Canada? How much tourism does Canada really get to see how it affects foreigners when using Canadian money? How many of them know about it? Why not jsut get rid of everything smaller than the $ and be like the Yen?

The nickel and dollar bill go, and the dollar coins make up for the missing bill, and the nickel won't be missed, because you only ever need 1 of them. They can treat them like the half (which also only ever takes 1 for change) and make them for collectors only if they want.

if we get rid of the ones place for our "less than dollar" rounding tools, then we might as well get rid of money and the gov't just issue something like a Visa/MasterCard to everyone and call it a currency card, then no change ever need to be handled again.

Math doesn't lie.

Loss is still a loss. What you have there is spin, which is a fancy way of saying "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!"

If I had a product that was losing money, I would kill it, especially knowing that I would still be selling the others. The mint has this, because killing the cent will not hurt demand of the other denominations. The cent is not a loss-leader (it does not create demand for the other products), so you have to stop treating it that way.


They already do it (rounding) with sales tax. They just do not realize it, since they are looking at the POS readout and giving change. When the POS terminal is changed to round to a nickel (or dime), they will have no idea; they will just continue to hand out what the display says.


True, which is why I am right.


I am really having a difficult time telling if you are serious or seriously trolling. Really, do you honestly think that could/would happen?

What do you, Shadz, really get for keeping the cent? Would it really affect you if it went away?

The cent is not being minted because the people want it. It is being minted because of special interest. Stop trying to defend it and move on. We have bigger problems out there.

Seigniorage! that is a much better word than profit I have been using, since it is the right term, and in regards the US Treasury claims that for every dollar worth of coins, they Treasury made 45 cents in 2011.

Maybe that will help bring into perspective that they are NOT losing money on coins when you look at the REAL picture, and the US is the biggest user of seigniorage for its mathing out these things.

The State Quarters made $6.3 billion in seigniorage for just those 56 designs, the treasury estimates.

So where is this lost money?

seigniorage = face value - cost, and is figured on TOTAL minting, not individual coins.

yeah, the penny costs more than face, but in total the Mint is still making more at face value than it costs to make ALL the coins they make.

Again, nickel and quarter aren't needed, but if they are making $630 million per year with these sets of 50 quarters, then sure let them keep the things, so long as they keep the penny to make change for it. I still say we only need $1, 10 cent, and 1 cent coins though.

the numbers tel the truth, that we don't need to get rid of either the nickel or the penny, but it wouldn't hurt anything to get rid of the nickel as they are the least needed for making change, and we NEED to get rid of the virus, bacteria, cocaine, meth covered $1 bills.

Your numbers and post made little sense. The way you wrote it a cent today could buy as much as 24 cents in 1914. Do you know how much 24 cents could buy in 1914? in the late 40s a nickel could buy a pound of candy. That is AFTER the depression, so I imagine in 1014 that same nickel could have bought a good deal more. maybe a cent could have bought a pound of candy.

So what are you trying to say?

I think you mean 24 cents can buy today what 1 cent bought in 1914, but you have presented it backwards if that is the case.

I'm sorry you aren't understanding. The cent has about 1/25 the buying power it had a 100 years ago. Your grandpa didn't need such a small valued coin and neither do you. Not sure how much more plainly to write it.

Me well off? Ha!

The point was that in 1914 a dime bought what a dollar does today. So, when making change, did they need a tenth of a cent? Because today, a cent only buys what a tenth of a cent could buy 1914.

That is, we got along well without a tenth of a cent coin in 1914, we should be able get along without the cent coin in 2014.

Get it?