Future Of Kennedy Half Dollars

No, it was not averted. I stand by my answer.

It has been shown time and time again how confused people are with the money we spend. Adding a polymer note (because it cannot just replace the cloth over night) will just add confusion ("Did it replace the paper?" "Did it replace the coin?"). I am not saying that it is a good reason, just that it is a reason those who oppose change will use. "Now we have to remember two different types of notes and a coin?"

If we could not handle a change to a dollar coin, we can not handle a change to a polymer note, let alone trying to get all three to coexist.

I still say kill the one dollar note and issue the dollar coins. Suck it up people and get over it.

I am a Dansco collector of coins...that and world bullion. The Kennedy album goes from 1964 - 2011 and I REALLY debated buying the new 2012 album figuring I didn't need any more Kennedy's especially when the silver 2012 proof set took off so much in price. The regular clad proof set as well for that matter. But I did buy it so I guess as long as they make them..I will buy them.....Do I think they are "necessary". No

"probably" = speculative. Definitely not worth coercing people into a system they don't want when there is another option.

...and...

Even if there were a major design change any possible (?) confusion, this time around would only be over one denomination - 1.00 bills - instead of (what was it?) the two or thee major denomination overhauls at a time where they changed from small to large portraits, offsetting the image, adding a watermark, adding the plastic strip, adding the reflective ink, etc. Although people were talking about the new designs, everything went smoothly.

Each time a small change is made, it gets plastered all over anyway - reference the last 100.00 bill redesign.



Who there...
Because there is no choice? Since the SBA's people have had the choice for paper or coin - and always rejected coin. People were even made aware of the Sac when they came out by the coins even being inside Cheerios boxes! I remember being there - they were all over advertised - people liked the novelty - wanted a few - and stashed them away. Very few ever wanted to use them - they had the choice!

Also by saying there is no choice, it contradicts your saying we need to eliminate choice by doing away with the dollar bills so everyone will have to use coins.

People have the choice - they can get coins when they want them - as proven by the forum threads where people are getting them and spending them. In fact I was just at the bank yesterday and saw a small pile of them I easily could have had if I had wanted or had use for them. But like the teller said, people don't like carrying them around.


One or two are novelty items that "might be worth something some day." But daily use - not wanted.



Yes and no. That's not settled. It was quite awhile ago we discussed costs on a different thread. The PRODUCTION costs are likely a savings, but the transportation costs of metal vs paper for the little man, individual banks (and ensuing costs passed on to the little man) is not figured into the government study on this. And...that's money out our pockets. Another thing not in that study was the devaluation of the dollar over the time that it was said was needed to see the advantage. The savings is there, but not so much for the little guys who always end up bearing the brunt of money mismanagement (like paper notes), and not near as much as was being touted.



VERY, true. Too bad it was not (although then I might not have the cool little Sac's they have been making the last few years ).
But since the money to make more bills IS going to be spent - let's make polymer and save money (like they will really do it).




This was also discussed before and we both polled the Canadians on the forum. They are not any better for it. The Canadians have had Loonies long enough the generation using the coins never had any other choice to compare it with. So negative remarks are not as common as they were in the day the Canadians were forced to switch (including the negative CBC article linked to in one of those threads about reinforcing pockets again because of the Toonie). Production costs may have gone down (don't known for sure but I suspect), but I do have first hand knowledge with the little man being the ones who have had to foot the bill (reference older threads concerning banks needing to raise prices on services b/c of losing money on shipping mounds of metal to get larger bills rather than much-less-weight paper, people with vending companies and the inconvenience of 1,000 coins instead of bills etc.etc.). Better? Subjective. Canadians old enough to remember the pre-Loonie days said they liked the bills better, and don;t like that now everyone has to have a change cup in the car to take care of all the coins they accumulate instead of carting the excess around in their pockets (older thread references)?

But we digress - America is not the rest of the world. We became what we did b/c we were for the little guy. We always dared to be different and ended up on top for it. There was a day when coercion by the government was always looked down upon as an evil by powermongers b/c the US was under a government system like no other - the rights of the individual were to be supreme from our very foundation (let's not go into moral relativism).




As has been debated and shown on the previous threads (and lightly re-hashed above)...the coins are not the clear cut, economical advantage that they were claimed to be. Instead they have been a waste of our money and caused an issue with those who so badly wish people would accept the coins they are willing to lessen the value of the desires of the majority of others and want to see a coerced conformity.

As you suggest, what we have is definitely more "political" in nature as is always the case with everything anymore having to do with the "powers that be."

Approaching this from the side of the issue where freedoms and freedom of choice of the people is most important, it is still befuddling how the lack of substance touted for the coins is worth coercing the majority of people to conform to the wishes of the few - when a viable option is there.


The option for both people to be happy is present now since anybody who want the coins can use them and get them. It still seems to me the real problem is that people who don't see their preference being the one everyone else likes are just frustrated enough to ignore that others' desires should be as valuable as their own.

Even if the polymer notes were made - the coins would likely still be in the vaults... and some just don't like that.

And... being human, I am more than willing to admit I have done the same thing at times in my own life.

@Fox


I agree - no argument from me on that one at all! I'd like to see them also.

My main point in posting about the dollar coin was so that people see they presently DO have an option of dollar or bill, and there simply is no valid reason for making everyone conform to the choice of what a minority of people want. In fact, over the years this issue has been debated on this forum quite a few times. Every supposed great advantage of the dollar coin has been shown to not be near what was stated when they were trying to push these so hard. Personally, and I may be wrong since it is only an opinion, I think the push for them was likely some large entity trying to get the business for themselves to make the blanks - like the company who makes us have paper bills likely will fight changing to polymer.

The facts are that polymer notes would save money, and the majority of the people want bills. I was hoping to have people who complain we don't have a dollar coin would take a look at why they desire the cins so much, and that they would take the time to see how the reality of their motivation stacks up against how much they value others' desires compared to their own.

I lived on the Canadian border when the Loonie was forced on the Canadians. I found myself debating people on this forum who had never been through the experience, and were adamant that the dollar coins were such a great idea all the way around. They denied the many issues such as the "weight issue" were a reality and said people who beleived these issues were just making it up because they did not like the coins. They quoted all sorts of numbers and things that work OK on paper, but in reality, their inexperience was shown to be nothing but theory based on their personal desires in the end. I polled the Canadians on this forum so the fact of the matter would resurface from those who had the coins forced on them. And just like supposed other issues with how great the dollar coins would be, the facts of what have happened prove otherwise. Weight is a very real issue that inconveniences the little guy when dollar coins are used. When you went go through it - its different than the current generation of Canadians that never lived in the society where they didn't have the weight issue so have no concept of it either.

And I admit when Canada was going through it, I was glad I lived in the US where the government making such a forced issue like this would be considered almost criminal. Now we have younger people who don't mind being coerced when it is something they personally desire.



I am not sure what you are saying here.

But I will say if you don't believe the weight is a valid issue, please do some homework and find on the forum where the Canadians were polled. On at least on e of the forums is a link to a CBC (Canadian news) article where they were making light of it, but were not happy their government was AGAIN going to force them to reinforce their pockets again to carry even more weight b/c the two dollar coin was being forced on them.

I also grew up with a weekly run with my grandfather taking change to the bank from his business. Try carting 2,000.00 worth of metal change to the bank vs. 2,000.00 worth of paper. The hands on experience will shed more light on the weight issue.

So once more it still seems the coin-only group want the bill-people-majority to be forced because because...because...um ...coin-only people like coins only.

There is an amiable solution for everyone. But it seems the desire from coin-only people to have what they want is more important to them.

I have been a counselor and teacher for 20+ years. People's emotions and motivations fall into patterns. And although it is NOT a perfect system of identifying situations, it comes close most times.

The pattern that mostly seems to emerge (and remember we are dealing with non-F2F which adds less credibility) through the years of the dollar coins debates (here or otherwise), all too many times it very mush appears (not that word) to be emotions making the plea.

If we would start rounding to tens, we could get rid of the 1 cent and 5 cent and 25 cent coins. All we would need after that is a dime and smaller octagonal Kennedy half that would actually circulate. Get rid of $1 notes and use the stockpile of $1 coins.

Uh, I want it because it saves money, not because I like coins.

@Conder - if these coins had proven to be the incredible money savers they were supposed to have been, the wanting them for the savings is totally legitimate.

However,one of the first times I participated in this dollar coin debate online here I downloaded the study and examined it. The final verdict on the numbers was that it did save some, but nowhere near what was touted. Other countries than us have gone to polymer - and I DO NOT KNOW - but I suspect any money the coins were supposed to (but fall short due to likely unintentional lack of inclusion of data - not crying foul!) likely would be at least the same or superceded by polymer (but I do NOT have the figures - I am only seeing what other countries have done and think there must, therefore be merit in it).

Sorry no link to the previous discussions - but they are on the forum if research is desired.

@sel 691


It is more complex than this. We are talking of two different cultures and two different economic societies that lead to curren tnorms. As a typical example... just across our northern border is a great country that has alaways used a 2.00 as readily as a 1.00. Us Yanks never could accept them for some reason. WHy? I am not sure anyone knows. I suspect though that it might be the numbers used for price tags in Canada have always been higher numbers. Note I did not say things are more expensive - b/c mostl things are not more expensive in Canada when compared to U.S. prices in U.S. dollars - meat & gas being two exceptions). They always had higher dollar signs to pay out - but they also are given more dollars/hour. SO it may be their natural use of the two is simply from higher numbers passing through their hands in daily commerce.

The US half.mostly before the 60s was enough to have in your pocket to get you through a day. When prices started to escalate after precious metals were removed, people did not like carrying multiples of the larger coins and stopped using them. This is what I was continually told growing up by older people I asked b/c I liked using halves and keeping them on me even as a kid. They always said that as prices went up, it just got to much of a bother to have a bunch of large coins weighing down your pockets.

@X2an


If polymer is used, the life of the bills is extended. A viable option for US people to keep what the majority want is upheld. This USED to be the cherished American way of handling things.

@Fox
I agree with about everything you say except with forcing the half on people as it is. The issue is US people have repeatedly said they don;t want a lot of large coins in their pockets. I don't know if reducing the size would work in our country or not. But if they do it the same way they did the SBA, it would be doomed to fail as well.

As to the 2.00 - I always personally liked them, but I think (note that word) the stigma on them was that when larger denominations become the norm, costs of everything upward adjust to accommodate. I cite the Loonie and Canada as an example. The Loonie became the new "pocket change" and prices adjusted upwards to reflect that (hence tons more $ in costs from the little guy that could never be figured into the savings reports).

Who knows, it might just be that prices have gone up enough in the States people might accept the 2.00 if it were mass distributed more. Its hard to tell. A polymer 2.00 would certainly save money and be a good idea.

As to the germ issue. I admit I have never looked into how much the paper keeps on it vs. the metal surfaces. I know that if you take a dollar coin (or copper) coin in your hand, and then smell your hand, it smells of the coin. Any person roll searching on this forum will tell you how filthy their hands are after handling much change (try it!).

Bills have their own smell, and its also not long before it gets on you. I would like to see something scientific on how filthy the paper is vs the metal ... but would hate tax dollars be wasted on it

I agree. Some people do not get it and they never will. I am fine with that, as long a they stay out of the way of progress. The good news is that the younger generation gets it, and that gives me hope.