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Replies: 32 / Views: 5,013 |
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Valued Member
United States
68 Posts |
I have mentioned this before here. This is ebay's answer to seller protection. It is up to the seller to discover whom they are dealing with. Every seller in the world has always reserved the right to refuse service to anyone. The internet gives everyone anonymity. Thus making it difficult to determine who those "anyone"'s are. I had a sale where I did the exact same thing. The bidder was a little more obvious in my case, all his FB's were negative and involved cases. It seems ebay is doing this to get rid of lazy buyers who open cases, but it is affecting the frugal shopper. My own feedback is as checkered as yours, partly because I have bad luck, but partly because like you, I combover questionable auctions, looking for a deal. I suspect as more legitimate sellers discover this ability, it will become more second nature. Buyers like you and myself will have to prove we are not trying to bait and switch, but rather simply expect to receive what we read.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1536 Posts |
Quote: My own feedback is as checkered as yours, partly because I have bad luck, but partly because like you, I combover questionable auctions, looking for a deal. I suspect as more legitimate sellers discover this ability, it will become more second nature. Buyers like you and myself will have to prove we are not trying to bait and switch, but rather simply expect to receive what we read. Exactly, I bid on some things looking for a deal that are kind of checkered, sometimes the seller has little to no existing feedback. No, matter I expect to get what is in the listing. If I don't I will open a case and if the seller doesn't want to make it right, I will leave negative feedback. Naturally I hit some bad eggs. In some cases, I am certainly not the only one leaving negative feedback. The safest bet is sticking to sellers with a good reputation with many positive feedback. I just bought some coins from sellers like that with no issues at all. Those sellers that avoid any type of negative feedback by avoiding sellers that will negative feedback, probably need some so buyers don't bid on their actions. Nobody needs to buy coins off someone who thinks it is privilege to buy off them. Maybe if denying service is your thing, close your doors and deny them to everyone.
Edited by buddy16cat 04/12/2015 3:50 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
Quote: My own feedback is as checkered as yours, partly because I have bad luck, but partly because like you, I combover questionable auctions, looking for a deal. I suspect as more legitimate sellers discover this ability, it will become more second nature. Buyers like you and myself will have to prove we are not trying to bait and switch, but rather simply expect to receive what we read. People that buy questionable listings looking for a deal are gambling.....& need to accept the consequences of their actions. I'm not in any way excusing sellers from shipping the item that's in the their listing. However, many times I hear about buyers that bought a coin/item with fuzzy pictures(or no reverse picture, or assumed it came with..., or whatever) because they "thought" it might grade higher, or wasn't cleaned, or was a certain variety, or it looked like that might be X at the edge of that pile. When it turns out their gamble was wrong it's somehow the sellers fault. There's a reason those type auctions sell for less than market value. If you aren't willing to accept the risk don't bid on those type auctions.
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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
It's not that leaving a Neg in the right circumstance is improper - if the seller's wrong, he's wrong - but as you're learning, engaging in high-risk behavior that increases your likelihood of leaving a Neg has a direct effect on your own reputation.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1536 Posts |
Quote: People that buy questionable listings looking for a deal are gambling.....& need to accept the consequences of their actions. I'm not in any way excusing sellers from shipping the item that's in the their listing. However, many times I hear about buyers that bought a coin/item with fuzzy pictures(or no reverse picture, or assumed it came with..., or whatever) because they "thought" it might grade higher, or wasn't cleaned, or was a certain variety, or it looked like that might be X at the edge of that pile. When it turns out their gamble was wrong it's somehow the sellers fault. There's a reason those type auctions sell for less than market value. If you aren't willing to accept the risk don't bid on those type auctions. It really depends on what the seller lists. I expect to be sent what is listed no matter who they are. I have gotten a great lot from people with 5 feedbacks. There are times I accept the risks like this lot below: http://www.ebay.com/itm/US-Indian-C...p=true&rt=ncRemember without the A-Z garauntee people would be less likely to give people a break and place a bid. This was a nice lot here, the seller had little to no feedback at the time: http://www.ebay.com/itm/COINS-AND-C...p=true&rt=ncThe last two negatives I left were actually about jewelery I bought for gifts and weren't lots. One looked obviously fake and not what they listed and the other was just junk. I watched a video about Chinese jewelery scams, listing fake and plated nickel jewelery as the real deal.
Edited by buddy16cat 04/13/2015 5:37 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
I'm not sure I'm getting my point across. I agree that it's totally the seller's responsibility to send what is in their listing. It's also the buyers responsibility to be sure they are bidding on what's there & not what they think might be there. On your first link all I can tell is that the coins look like the reverse of Indian cents......but I can't tell if they are real or fake much less condition. IMO whatever the seller sends IS what is listed. The second listing has clear enough pictures to tell what's there & I don't see that as being a gamble. The buyer should receive what's pictured.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1536 Posts |
Quote:I'm not sure I'm getting my point across. I agree that it's totally the seller's responsibility to send what is in their listing. It's also the buyers responsibility to be sure they are bidding on what's there & not what they think might be there. On your first link all I can tell is that the coins look like the reverse of Indian cents......but I can't tell if they are real or fake much less condition. IMO whatever the seller sends IS what is listed. The second listing has clear enough pictures to tell what's there & I don't see that as being a gamble. The buyer should receive what's pictured. What I saw on that first link is a bunch of lower grade Indian heads that appear to be mostly non-culls, no copper-nickels and there was no mention of any dates. If you are that concerned about fakes you can' t buy lower grade, common Indian cents for 70 cents a piece, I don't know what to tell you. They are not fakes and SELLING FAKES AS REAL COINS IS AGAINST ebay POLICY. They could have been all 1907s but fortunately they were from 1880-1908 mostly VG-F with the exception of one 1868 with a small scratch. I get your point, expect to send what is there and if you can't tell, accept what you get with the exception if it breaks ebay's policy. Here is one coin from the lot: 
Edited by buddy16cat 04/13/2015 6:27 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
I get that selling fakes as real coins is against ebay policy. I'm not so sure that selling fakes that are stamped COPY is against the rules. I suppose a case could be made that the seller was calling them world coins instead of copies. Either way, I'm not so concerned about fakes that I won't pay 70 cents for a coin, it's that I'm not interested in buying a pig in a poke in the hopes that I WON'T end up with a bunch of garbage. I'm glad it worked out for you. My comments aren't really directed at anyone here. I belong to several forums & there seems to have been an outbreak of people recently complaining about sellers and/or leaving negatives for sellers that aren't justified. There are plenty of scam type sellers out there the work the system & an equal number of buyers that do the same.
Edited by trdhrdr007 04/13/2015 8:46 pm
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Valued Member
United States
68 Posts |
Wow! I didn't mean to start an age old argument here. For that, I apologize to the OP for any derailment. However, I feel you are both right. It simply depends on your point of view. Whether primarily a seller or buyer. Sometimes when I buy and "gamble" I reread the auction. Should I determine that I may have misread the auction and the seller was smart with their wording, I do accept the loss. I tend to not leave feedback at all in those instances. While at the same time, when I sell, it sometimes is still a gamble. I.E. when I allow "checkered" buyers to bid with impunity, because I'm hoping for the highest amount possible. Regardless if I cherry pick the bidders, which I will continue to do to bidders with only negative FB and cases on every auction. Anything else is just bad business. Finally, there will always be an instance with mitigating circumstance. Maybe the seller was unaware of any wrong doing, because they didn't know what they had was counterfeit. Special circumstance call for judging those instance on their merit. My original intent remains the knowledge that there is seller protection on ebay. Its my hope that both buyers and sellers understand, use properly, and accept it. No! I don;t work for ebay, but as a tool, it only works if the majority work it.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1536 Posts |
Anyhow, I contacted ebay support and they said the seller is not using bid retraction in the way it was intended. It was not intended for you to cherry pick buyers. It was meant to be used if there were mistakes in the listing or the bidder entered something incorrectly. According to ebay, leaving negative or neutral feedback is the buyer's right and necessary to let other buyers know what is going on with a seller.
Edited by buddy16cat 04/14/2015 6:22 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5394 Posts |
No ..but a smart seller who knows the ins and outs of ebay sure knows how to manage their favourite buddies list. If we even think there is going to be a difficulty with a potential bidder buyer, we exercise our right to make them a favourite buddy. In any store and ebay is a store a seller has every right to decide if they wish to refuse service. If we get an offer on a BIN we certainly see what kind of feedback buyers leave. if their trail is littered with negs and general unhappiness off they go to the Buddies list! After 40 years in this business I suffer fools very lightly and have no times for bidiots. It is part of the earned right of getting old and cranky gracefully!  . In my learned opinion ebay makes it easy for buyers to destroy a good sellers reputation if they so desire.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
Quote:Anyhow, I contacted ebay support and they said the seller is not using bid retraction in the way it was intended. It was not intended for you to cherry pick buyers. It was meant to be used if there were mistakes in the listing or the bidder entered something incorrectly. According to ebay, leaving negative or neutral feedback is the buyer's right and necessary to let other buyers know what is going on with a seller. In a perfect world there isn't anything wrong with ebay's system & policies. Unfortunately it's not a perfect world. Buyers absolutely need to be warned about problem sellers. By the same token sellers need to be warned about problem buyers. IMO the system ebay has chosen is too slanted in favor of the buyer.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5394 Posts |
@TRD oh how true. It was a far fairer system when you could warn the ebay community about bidiots by leaving negs for buyers.
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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Yeah, and you could also contact bidders in active auctions and undercut the seller's prices.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5394 Posts |
\that is why only BIN for us. We almost never do ebay auctions anymore.
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Replies: 32 / Views: 5,013 |