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Valued Member
186 Posts |
MANSFELD-EIGENTLICHE-HINTERORT, Thaler, 1609   |
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Valued Member
186 Posts |
Mansfeld Bornstedt,Thaler 1607,damaged but still a very nice coin in my opinion!   |
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Valued Member
186 Posts |
I have quite a few left but I decided to stop as there's better crowns than mine to be posted here!Does anyone know if there's any updated edition of the Krause catalogue 1601-1700, 5 edition,2011?I'm trying to see values for some of my crowns but the catalogue messes things up quite bad at times. I mean I have a crown only known in a few pieces but is not being described as rare which is very funny.Plus, the first coin posted, the 1645 GN Frankfurt thaler, seems to be overvalued at 6000 in vf!Any crowns reference books would be helpful.Thank you for your time and I apologize for any mistakes, english is not my native language!
Edited by paulCT
01/04/2018 07:19 am
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Moderator
 United States
188952 Posts |
Quote:
I've decided to show some of my crowns but the quality of the pictures is not great so I must apologize. They look good to me. Thank you for sharing.  |
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Valued Member
 United States
414 Posts |
Hi Paul; that's some great material. Thanks for sharing. As for your question about the catalogues, there is a 6th edition. https://www.amazon.com/Standard-Cat...p/1440244669I am also happy to help with providing valuation on coins if you'd like. Book value is one thing, but when dealing with rarer coins, BV is generally of little help. I have memberships to search archives and can do a search on a given coin to see what it sold for. |
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Valued Member
186 Posts |
jbuck Pleasure is on my side!I'm very happy to have the chance to contribute to such a nice topic!
cableguy815 Thanks for the info!As you can see my coins are not the best grades as I collect on a budget.Even so I bought them at decent prices so I'm not on the losing side.What keeps me going is the passion for coins and especially large, 16-18 century ones.I'm aware of the book value vs market value difference as I've been constantly following the evolution of the common crowns and I agree that with the rare ones is a different story.My guess is that you're talking about coinarchive pro which is a very good tool to have!Should you have time it'd be interested to hear your opinion on the value of some of the coins I posted above. Also if I'm not asking too much please search for a bozzolo tallero km46/ Dav. #3854.I tried to find previous sales of this coin but couldn't find any.Thank you for your time and congrats on this great topic!
Edited by paulCT
01/04/2018 2:42 pm
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New Member
Netherlands
36 Posts |
Welcome onboard, paulCT! Some nice coins you have here.
May I ask you what is the weight/diameter/alignment of your MANSFELD-EIGENTLICHE-HINTERORT 1609 thaler?
I have the same coin for years, but since mine is only about 20 grams (if I remember correct) and the obv./rev. alignment is about 30 degrees off centre. I always thought it is a fake or replica coin, although I haven't actually researched anything about it.
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Valued Member
United States
414 Posts |
Paul - I looked into the Bozzolo Tallero and there are only a handful of relevant entries I am able to find. As I am sure you are aware, this is an exceedingly rare coin. I am also certain you are aware of the book value (which I believe to be of little value here). I was able to find 2 sales for Bozzolo Talleros, both with a lion on the obverse.
2006 - Sold for about $8,600 not including premium. I'd grade it in XF - AU range
2016 - Sold for about $7,900 not including premium. I'd grade it in VF range
Hope that helps. As for the value of the above coins, I'll need some time to look it up. Like you, I collect world crowns, but I generally restrict myself to crowns of the 18th century onwards. Crowns from before (like your samples above), I find incredibly difficult to grade accurately. How much is wear? How much is just bad "strike"? Secondly, though I do not believe them to be common, these coins are in my view ideal candidates for forgeries. Each coin is unique, weighs differently, and the detail is usually splotchy making it hard to tell which is authentic and which is not. I'll give value based on my assumed grade (and I am far from an expert).
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1156 Posts |
@GERMANICVS said: Quote:
I collect coins from the Santiago, Chile mint.
Here are some of my Santiago 8 Reales:...Santiago Mint 8 Reales 1787. Carlos III
Ah ha! I saw this coin on CoinTalk. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1156 Posts |
I have not posted this "crown" here yet (according to "My Previous Uploads" -- what a great feature). 1720 rouble, Kadashevsky mint.  |
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Pillar of the Community
Germany
1849 Posts |
Hello jgenn, yes, that was me.
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Valued Member
186 Posts |
dulitu Thanks for having me!
Mine is 28.4 gr/40mm/i!/silver.I don't really know what's the story with this type but I've seen quite a few weighting around 22.4-24 gr being sold as genuine.The weight variation is quite interesting but 20-22 gr is too much for a 1/2 thaler and still a lot less than a thaler.Some italian thalers are known to weight between 21-27gr so maybe it's something similar in this case.You might want to open a new topic on this because I'm pretty sure there's quite a few collectors sharing our question!
Edited by paulCT
01/05/2018 03:24 am
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Valued Member
186 Posts |
cableguy815 Thank you for your research!The bozzolo lion dollar is R5(Varesi)and a special coin to have.Mine is an R4, with 4 similar pieces being in the royal collection of V.Emmanuel III.Though extremely rare,krause doesn't consider it so.Going back to your coins I have to say that they're all awesome but the Basel n.d(1710) thaler is simply a beast!I love that one!18 century crowns are great(sede vacante,city view thalers,etc)and they have less flaws than older crowns plus there's a good chance to buy them in top grades.I consider the older ones somewhat common due to their high mintage caused by a great need of a large,valuable coin to sustain wars and economic relations at that time.Weight wise, thalers shouldn't vary too much as most of them are around 28-29gr but if it's a clipped one it's likely to be underweight.For ducatons or ecu's of Philip II I've seen variations of 1-4 gr for example.Poor striking was the major problem in my opinion and we have here patagons,silver ducats,silver riders,ecu's,also the well known swiss thalers,Saint Gall(bear),Schaffhausen(ram)and the list goes on and on.Forgeries?You're spot on,plenty, but if one is not able to see the difference between a Chinese forgery and a genuine coin then he needs to start studying more.Spotting a well made, silver forgery requires the eye of an expert.As they say, know the coin or know the dealer!I usually buy from german top coin dealers which can be found on ma-shop and avoid ebay unless it's a a reliable seller.One of the best ebay coin dealers is also a member of this community,coinworldtv,very knowledgeable and professional, always selling quality crowns so you should check him in case you don't know him already!Thank you for your time and I apologize for my long post!All the best! Edited by paulCT
01/05/2018 08:05 am
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Pillar of the Community
Belgium
1185 Posts |
Robert Dudley, Earl of Leicester Governor-General (1585-1587) of the United Provinces (Dutch Republic) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rober...of_Leicestertype 1 issue (1587) Holland (rare) OBV: Leicester holding a bundle of arrows (symbol for the United provinces) Concordia Res Parvae Cresc unt (United => Stronger) REV: Coats of arms of the six united provinces  |
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Pillar of the Community
Belgium
1185 Posts |
Robert Dudley, Earl of Leicester Governor-General (1585-1587) of the United Provinces (Dutch Republic) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rober...of_Leicestertype 2 issue (1595) Overijssel (extremely rare, perhaps unique) REV: Coats of arms of the SEVEN united provinces: Overijssel was added to the leage of united provinces, it is the right CoA on the lower row) Happy to have bought this coint: although weak strike, unattractive portrait, and adjustment traces, it is extremely rare moreover, this seems to be a die anomaly : it is the only known Leicester rijksdaalder where the arrow bundle is placed within the area of the inner circle  |
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Posted 01/04/2018 07:06 am
