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 Replies: 117 / Views: 11,768 |
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CCF Sponsor
 Canada
149 Posts |
Or I'll just do it now cus I can't sleep... ebay and Allegro auctions are both connected to my dads email. When I sent NCS the coin I gave them my personal email so they could send me the photos of the coin. After the coin got removed from Allegro. I received this email TO MY ACCOUNT. "Hi Thomas, We believe the 1932 Poland 5z coin or the holder on invoice 5211716 may have been tampered with. Could you please send this coin back to us for a determination. We would like to resolve this to the satisfaction of everyone as quickly as possible. Thank you. Regards, Mark Mark Baughman NGC Ext. 187" I'm curious where they got my email when my dads was the one on the auction sites. I did get a phone call from 2 people saying the coin was fake the day the coin got removed. One of them was Stan Kaminski from Mississauga. One of NCS representatives in Canada. He is Polish too, I asked him if he could take a look at the coin to double check if it's a fake. He told me that it wasn't his responsibility. I asked him to do this a few days after he called me. I was useing NCS photos for the auctions. I'm curious why NCS would keep saying that the holder was tampered with. Are they saying that because they can see that it was altered from there own photo? I find that really funny. After I talked to Mark I explained to him that I was the one who sent the coin in so there is NO CHANCE WHAT SO EVER THAT THE HOLDER WAS TAMPERED WITH! Which I'm sure he already knew about because he had my email, and I'm sure they keep the photos on file. He told me that he understands and that he knows it hasn't been touched. Mid January I received this letter in the mail.  Once again stating that the holder was tampered with. That's another reason why I don't want to send the coin into NCS. They are just trying to get out of this situation with out paying for the coin. It's a business they are in it too make money. The letter also states that if I sell the coin they no longer take responsibility for it. I think NCS should wright this on there web site. "WE ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY FAKE COINS IN OUR HOLDERS" I'm getting so mad..   Letter edited by Forum Mod to remove members personal infoEdited by LondonCoin
02/19/2009 03:23 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
It sounds like you are at an impasse. For some reason NCS thinks the slab has been tampered with & want to examine it before they do anything. You won't send it in for inspection because you think they "are just trying to get out of this situation with out paying for the coin." I really don't see any way for both parties to be satisfied, unless you hand deliver the coin for inspection while you watch.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
The letter is disturbing. It basically says that if you don't send it back to them then they are washing their hands of their obligations under the guarantee. But if you do send it back you are bound to accept whatever they decide to give you for it. It's a damned if you do damned if you don't situation. Maybe a letter back saying you will be happy to send it back for examination once the two of you have agreed on what appropriate compensation would be if the holder is not tampered with and the coin is fake. You should send them copies of sales records, preferably auction records, to establishwhat the market value is. Otherwise they may just say "well the Krause catalog says it's worth 175 to 350 dollars and that's all we'll pay."
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
I don't think it's unreasonable for NCS to want to examine the coin/holder before they pay. There is nothing in this letter that says they will pay anything less than fair market value for the coin. The purchaser has indicated an offer they consider inadequate has been made, but that's not evident in this correspondence.
The letter clearly states they will not be obligated if the coin is not sent back to them. That doesn't seem unreasonable either. Otherwise, there is nothing to keep the purchaser from selling the coin to a "straw man" for an inflated amount, with the "straw man" then making a claim in that amount. At this point both NCS & the purchaser are aware of a potential problem with the slab/coin, which needs to be resolved before the coin changes hands again.
From this thread there is no way to know what the true market value of the coin is. All we know is that the purchaser thinks it's worth more than what NCS offered. We don't know if that's because the purchaser has unreasonable expectations or if it's because NCS is trying to low ball. To further confuse the value issue, it wouldn't be in a NCS slab if it wasn't a "problem" coin.
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CCF Sponsor
Canada
149 Posts |
There is no way I'm sending the coin to NCS. It's just not fair to me. I want to work out a price with them before I do. I trusted them once and I am not trusting them again.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
Quote:
There is no way I'm sending the coin to NCS. It's just not fair to me. I want to work out a price with them before I do. I trusted them once and I am not trusting them again. I understand your lack of trust, I just don't see any way for you to resolve your situation. If NCS is really out to cheat you all they have to do is agree to your price & tell you they will only pay once they have examined the coin. When they see it all they have to do is claim the slab has been tampered with & not pay anything. I hope you are able to work things out to your satisfaction. |
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CCF Sponsor
Canada
149 Posts |
If they told me the slab was tampered with I would DEFINITELY see them in court. I have a few good witnesses that would stand behind me. One of them is the president of Canadian Numismatic Society, plus a few other clubs.
Before I send the coin, I want a letter from NCS with a fair market value of the coin, or a letter saying they will return the coin in original holder if we can not work out a price.
I think that would make it fair to both of us.
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
1077 Posts |
I think you have to insist that they examine it with you in attendance.
I do not understand why they think it has been tampered with if they only have pictures of it that they took?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1231 Posts |
Are you avoiding this....
I think NCS's offer is relevant because you are assuming fair market value is $9,000++.
Is there a reason why you haven't posted this over on the NCS boards? Maybe you will get a response from them quicker. If you decide to post there provide current pictures of the slab(front,back and side views)
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CCF Sponsor
Canada
149 Posts |
Onejinex how can you say NCS offer is relevant when you don't know what they are offering?
Another thing is I'm not assuming what the value of the coin is. I KNOW what it is. If they don't want to pay for the coin, then I'll be happy with a replacement.
I contacted the CEO a couple days ago, he did contact me back. I will let everyone know how everything goes. I'm still talking to him, as of now it's not getting anywhere.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1267 Posts |
One thing's for sure. "Someone got, or is going to get -- hosed..."
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
The matter of the fair market value is why I said he needs to give then sales an auction records of what the coin has brought in the past. NGC is really into non-US coins and probably has no way to determine FMV other than by using the Krause Catalog which is apparently out in left field on this coin.
On the other hand I hope the OP is making allowances for the fact that the actual grade the FMV should be set at will be for a grade well below the sharpness grade because of the harsh cleaning. AU sharpness but a FMV of say a VF, maybe even a F, because of the cleaning.
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
1077 Posts |
 I've been trying to establish grade since page 3 of this thread. Not sure what it would be classed as but the cleaning and hairlines won't be doing it any favours. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1267 Posts |
This made me reactivate/find my password and screen-name on the NGC/NCS/PMG forum. It's been like five years since I logged on...
Edited by Bonedigger
02/20/2009 2:49 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1231 Posts |
You said Quote:
At this time I really don't want to be focused on what they are offering me. It is seriusly a JOKE. Well what they offering is relevant because that will help determine what they think fair market value is Quote:
Another thing is I'm not assuming what the value of the coin is. I KNOW what it is. You are assuming! Have you sold this particular coin alot? The coin is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it Quote:
If they don't want to pay for the coin, then I'll be happy with a replacement So you are going to spend $9,000+ on another one? NCS/NGC are not going to replace it. They are only going to pay fair market value. I'm not trying to be rude, just seems like there are still alot things we don't know about. |
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Posted 02/19/2009 09:57 am
