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 Replies: 285 / Views: 11,262 |
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Pillar of the Community
  United States
7963 Posts |
Time to post your coins that contain between 10 and 19% silver. I will start with this 1652 Lithuanian schilling KM#41 at 13% (0.125):   Edited by tdziemia
01/05/2024 08:10 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7963 Posts |
For collectors who might have any of these (j1m? spence?), the composition of Lithuanian and Polish schillings (solidus) struck after 1580 fall into this slice as follows:
1529-1545 (Torun,Elbing) - 19% (3/16ths pure)
1580-1601 (all mints?) 16% (2 3/5 /16ths pure)
1612-1623 Lithuania - 17% (2 3/4 /16ths pure)
1623-1627 (all mints) - 13% (2/16th pure)
1652-1653 Lithuania - 13%
From 1658 on, they fall below 10%
Edited by tdziemia
01/05/2024 10:50 am
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Moderator
 United States
34437 Posts |
I'll definitely take a look @tdz. In the meanwhile, here is a coin from my collection that I have never posted before. It is a very well worn 5 Groszy from the Russian Partition of Poland dated 1819. According to numista, it is 0.192 silver.   https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces25238.html"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7963 Posts |
Nice! I will "see you and raise you": this 10 groszy coin is the same composition 19% (Gumowski has it at 3 2/18 / 16ths pure) at the next highest denomination.   |
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Pillar of the Community
Russian Federation
5178 Posts |
Quote:
Lithuanian and Polish schillings (solidus) struck after 1580 Only one I can think of offhand in my collection that falls into this range is a Riga solidus from 1615. I do not see anything in this listing that would match Riga 1615, which suggests that the purity is likely either not known or not within the range. (Or maybe you just missed it.) I think I have a few other 10-19% options, but for now here's the promised 14th century 11% coin...   Republic of Venice, Antonio Venier (1382-1400) AR (billon) tornesello (for circulation in Crete) Numista 76361 (no purity figure given, but explained in description) As usual, I apologize for the absolutely horrible photos. As mentioned in Numista, the tornesello was minted at 8 parts copper to 1 part silver, theoretically corresponding to a purity of 1/9 = 0.111; in practice apparently Venetian standard silver was 0.965 pure, so the silver content of the tornesello must have been about 0.107, but in either case 11%. (The one tornesello of Antonio Venier that was actually destructively tested came out to 0.109 silver, which strongly suggests that the standard was in fact reasonably maintained even that late.) |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
25607 Posts |
My sole contribution to this range - 1962 Mexico 1 Peso @ 0.100  Inordinately fascinated by bits of metal with strange markings and figures
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Pillar of the Community
Sweden
2124 Posts |
Another 13 % and one 18 %: France 1578, Henry III liard, 0.125.  Dauphine 1369-1380, Charles V liard, 0.180.  I might have more . . .  |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5253 Posts |
Tdziemia has posted my 19% offering-the identical coin!
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5253 Posts |
I have some coins of Livonia: 1537-1590 under different administrations. Does anyone have the % of silver in that era?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7963 Posts |
Yowza! Great first day: 19, 18, 13, 11, and 10% @oriole, sorry I scooped you, but it will be duly noted that we both have that coin. @Hondo, that is a beauty. I think mint state examples of that type are fantastic coins! But once they start to tarnish .... ugh! @erafjel, great additions! There are a bunch of medieval Low Countries coins in the 14-16% range, probably analogs to the French denominations. I don't have any of them, but will provide a list later. @january1may (and oriole). So, Riga is a point of frustration for me on this thread. Riga was striking coins while under control of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth roughly 1580-1625. But the reference I have (Gumowski) differentiates the specifications for "crown mints" (Krakow, Poznan, Olkusz, Bromberg, etc), "Prussian mints" (Elbing, Torun), and Lithuania, but never lists the specifications for any coins struck in Riga  . I can think of two reasons: a. the Riga coins were struck to the same specification as the Lithuania coins. The reason I sugest this possibility is that Livonia first came under rule of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania (1560s I think) before the formation of the Polish-Lithuania Commonwealth. So, maybe the coinage systems were aligned with Lithuania at that point, and Gumowski never mentions that the specifications were the same because he thought it was obvious (or, maybe he does, but my aversion to working on German-to-English translation a sentence at a time has prevented me from finding it; Gumowski wrote his book in German). b. there is no record of the Riga mint specifications. Edited by tdziemia
01/05/2024 9:17 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7963 Posts |
I think the only other new composition I have for this slice is this schilling/solidus from the reign of Stefan Bathory, which should be 2 3/5 /16ths pure, or 16% (0.1625)   At this point, we have: 19% Poland 5 groszy KM#C96.3 (spence) ........Poland 10 groszy KM#C84 (tdziemia, oriole) 18% France/Dauphine Charles V liard (erafjel) 16% Poland Stefan Batory schilling N#96442 (tdziemia) 13% France Henry III liard N#43704 (erafjel) ........Lithuania schilling/solidus KM#41 (tdziemia) 11% Italy/Venice tornesello N#76361 (january1may) 10% Mexico 1 peso KM#459 (Hondo Boguss) For finding some of the missing compositions ... 17% Poland-Lithuania schilling 1612-1623 of Lithuania. These are available on ebay if anyone is interested. The type with an S on one side and side-by-side shields on the other side is the Lithuania type. (There is a different type for Riga ... per my earlier comments, I can;t confirm this one is the same composition, though it might be). 15% The 1/4 gros/groot struck in Burgundian/SPanish Netherlands under Philip the Handsome (GH# 122), or Charles V (GH# 175): https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces317386.html14% The 1/4 gros/groot from the same places struck slightly later (GH# 194) https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces102770.htmlEdited by tdziemia
01/06/2024 3:26 pm
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Moderator
United States
34437 Posts |
Sounds like this Schilling of Poland minted in Malbork in 1592 is 16% silver:   Unfortunately, I don't have one of those that you listed for 17%. "If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5253 Posts |
Folks, I have a Turkey 2 Zolota dated AH 1171 (K324). My older addition to Krause just states that it is billon. Can anyone confirm that it is the same 46.5% as in the newer ones of the same denomination? If so I will post it.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5253 Posts |
I found my Turkey Yuzluk K507, which takes the 47% spot   |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5253 Posts |
Quote:
@oriole, sorry I scooped you, but it will be duly noted that we both have that coin. @Tdziemia, I think that I made a mistake and actually have the 5 Gr. So not a scoop! Same % so we are taken care of. |
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Posted 01/05/2024 10:47 am
