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 Replies: 4,802 / Views: 394,107 |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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NOT saying I am right, the downside of the bullion version is....because the value is tied to the precious metal market.
NOT saying the collector version is all that, but, collectors will always be collecting. PM buyers float in and out with the price of PM's. Which is exactly my worry with the bullion versions even though the price is much better. The mint should really do something about the p price, whether they say it will always be 205 no matter what or even if they said even if silver was 5 dollars an ounce the P version would never be cheaper than 125 or 150 Id be comfortable buying them. Really if they just did anything to try and tie a coin value to it other than the PM value I think you would see a lot more of them sell, as people who are hesitant such as myself would have a reassurance. Im not into collecting to make money, but I dont want to spend 200 a coin to see them selling for 50 bucks in the not so distant future either |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
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I wouldnt be surprised if the P ended this year, the sales have been miserable at best I'm not too sure about that... After all, the Mint spent a ton of money to import that German medal press just for these "coins." If that press was just relegated to making the occasional congressional gold medal, and the silver and bronze duplicates, there might be some P/O'd stakeholders at the Mint. As it is both versions of the El Yunque puck have sold over 10K which is surprising for an unpopular product. Somebody obviously is buying these coins, so they will be continued to be offered in ever smaller numbers, just like the First Spouse gold coins. |
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
12869 Posts |
I just hope they keep bringing the mintage numbers down on the UNC if they continue to make these monsters. Maybe to 15k for the 2013 releases or something. Guess it all depends on sales figures of the 2011's and 2012's. Most of the 2011's haven't even come close to selling out. Gettysburg is the "closest" to selling out with 12.5k left.
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Maybe they can do another mint to demand lol.
In all seriousness they could just lower the mintage. I figured theyres a certain sales number they have to get to to start making money and make up the start up cost of the dies ect just not sure where that number would be. Arent the presses the same that make the bullion and the P?
As long as the set stays in the black we probably will see it go on with a 10k mintage or so, or they could decide they take up to much space in storage who knows. If they are going to keep it going they should say so.
I really cant understand why they think that secrecy is the best way to go about everything with these when uncertainty is what is killing the sales.
On a side note are the 2011 ones going to be sold forever? They arent going to sell out. How long till they start getting melted.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
15K might still be too many, as some of the ATB sites are totally unknown to even the most knowledgeable. An even better idea, CelticKnot, would be if they minted the pucks to order in 2013. I wouldn't mind ordering all five of the pucks all at once in late January/February and waiting 6-8 weeks for them as they mint and fill orders in groups. That way I wouldn't have to worry about them for the rest of the year, nor about how to pay for them, since it would be a done deal. Putting the Ag coins on a pricing grid might make them sell better as well. People could still order them spread out over a number of months based on their budget. The bullion pucks have quietly gone onto a mint to demand order basis and no one has commented about that, yet the flippers and speculators were hecka worried about mint to order on the ballyhooed SF annie set. Just goes to show the proportion of flippers to collectors is like 10:1. |
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Valued Member
United States
194 Posts |
I like that, Bizy. Sounds like the mint may be getting more creative, as the 2012 ASE set sales turned out to be well received after the fact...although a lot of complaining beforehand ;) |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12869 Posts |
I could get on board with the mint-to-demand idea, Bizy. Probably suits a product with a limited collector base like this well.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
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I really cant understand why they think that secrecy is the best way to go about everything with these when uncertainty is what is killing the sales. basebal21: I don't think it's so much "secrecy" but simply not knowing what to do with this product, so they kind of lurch from year to year and offer different marketing strategies. It's a completely new product offering, they have never even minted a "coin" this large before, so the market is a total unknown. They make the medals in 3" sizes but those are limited product runs, not heavily marketed nor made extensively available to the public. So thus, the importation of the press, to handle high volume bullion strikes. I expect there was much head scratching when Mint employees saw the provision about the 3" 5oz. coin. Typical 5oz. rounds are between 2" and 2 1/2" so this was going to be a completely new product from the ground up. Uncertainty is the best description of this series. |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
I don't think it's so much "secrecy" but simply not knowing what to do with this product, so they kind of lurch from year to year and offer different marketing strategies. It's a completely new product offering, they have never even minted a "coin" this large before, so the market is a total unknown. They make the medals in 3" sizes but those are limited product runs, not heavily marketed nor made extensively available to the public. So thus, the importation of the press, to handle high volume bullion strikes.
I expect there was much head scratching when Mint employees saw the provision about the 3" 5oz. coin. Typical 5oz. rounds are between 2" and 2 1/2" so this was going to be a completely new product from the ground up. Uncertainty is the best description of this series.
I agree with that. Secrecy was probably not the correct word to use, but their cluelessness is very apparent to the public. Even if they dont have a detailed plan would it be so hard to even just say "the P series will continue to be minted in 2013" and just say once a year that it will keep coming out of if they no theyll see it through to say it will continue through the series? Even the smallest bits of reassuring information from the mint for this series could make a big different. This is the one series where a mint to demand may work best, but again with no information we could see very low levels in the final numbers. Maybe some sort of hybrid of 10,000 mintage at least with any orders above 10k minted to demand for 1 year from the date of release. There may still be a few coins in the series that could pull high numbers but if gettysburg cant even sell out by now the days of needing a 45k mintage are gone for now |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1255 Posts |
I like the mint to demand idea with this series. I wish they would advertise this series more to keep the series alive, but on the flip side maybe some of those coins could end up being on the scarce side. I wish they would sell the pucks closer to melt prices on the P version. I wish they were worth more 25 cents, they could have at least made them worth 5 bucks. I also think some of these pucks look better in the bullion version than the vapor blast, but the vapor blast does have a different look to them. Maybe they should run some of the P pucks as regular finished proofs as a limited edition, that might sell a few more as well. Just my thoughts.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1255 Posts |
Do you think they will try to mint any other coins in the 3 inch version if this series does not work out? ASEs maybe?
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
Maybe they should run some of the P pucks as regular finished proofs as a limited edition, that might sell a few more as well. Just my thoughts. Id be for that if that would bring the price down. There maybe could be a limited ASE 3 inch run to try and get sales up for the 3 inch presses. The biggest issue though doesn't seem to be the coin just the huge premium on the collector version and the prospect of a 160 dollar bullion coin one day being worth 30 bucks |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
I don't know about a 3" ASE maybe if it were offered in 10oz. Might be an interesting buy. Some of the generically made " ASE" rounds in 10/12oz look pretty terrible, it's not a design that holds up well enlarged, unlike some of the pucks. Qtrs like Yellowstone, Glacier, Olympic are way too cluttered, but look magnificent magnified to 3". Because they are taken from pictorial scenes, they are meant to be seen in the large size. The designers make large prototypes then reduce them down to quarter sized. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1255 Posts |
I just received my Chaco Culture "P" puck yesterday. I like the coin, but I think this one really looks better with the bullion finish. I think sometimes the vapor blast finish tends to hide or shade some detail.
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Valued Member
291 Posts |
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Replies: 4,802 / Views: 394,107 |
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Posted 07/14/2012 11:29 am
