My First 10 Coins -Unidentified-

dougsmit => good luck hunting at the Richmond show (I'm always a bit jealous when I hear of people attending "live shows" ... sadly, I must live my coin life through this computer screen) ...



*sigh*

Unfortunately not relating to ancients, just ask the questions and someone will help you out eventually.



Yes and no, all ancients have been cleaned at some point, its true that you should try to keep the patina on the coin when cleaning if possible.

http://coins.about.com/od/coinsglos...n_patina.htm



I'd say mainly experience, certain Emperors and coins are more faked than others, generally the 4th century is the safest and best place to start to avoid fakes.



No, not when starting out but they can help to work out what denomination a coin is and can be a factor when deciding if a coin is fake, not definitive, just a deciding factor.



Personal choice really, keeping them dry is the only really important thing, most people just use silica gel pouches for that, the kind you get in the box when you buy shoes is fine. I sometimes use Renaissance Wax but not all the time and I just keep my coins in a wooden box on trays, many others use
plastic sleeves



Very unlikely to be fake but it has happened, generally fakers will fake higher value coins, its relatively rare to see $50 coins faked, almost unheard of to see $10 coins faked.



Is possible, some sellers are better than others but usually 'uncleaneds' have been sorted through three or four times for anything good before being sold in bulk. The finder will check them, the local dealer he sells to, the exporter, the importer etc. Godd and rare coins do still sneak through but they are few and far between.



Finding a nice Roman gold coin in an uncleaned lot would be about as likely as winning the lottery every week for about a year Anyone who says 'gold found!' in their lots is either lying or has included some tiny (and I mean tiny) Asian gold coins that are barely worth having. Gold does not tarnish so it will come out of the ground instantly recognisable for what it is, no finder would allow it to be sold along with crusty bronzes.



It could be bronze disease, 99% of the time its green but it can be other colours too. Best thing to do is soak it in distilled or de-ionised water (yes, answering the question in the other thread, both are the same, just purer H20). I dont know if the other coin above also has BD, best thing to do is soak them both. Link to a BD article, might help, searching the threads here would prob help too:

http://www.collector-antiquities.com/89/

I've not used many of the chemicals mentioned in some of the articles, distilled or de-ionised water has always done the job fine for me.

Thank you both so much for your valued information, got a couple more questions for you :3

Is handling/cleaning these types of coins safe to do bare handed? because I have been D: but I didn't give it much thought at the time.

The coins that appear dark/blackish like the const. two victories above, can they be cleaned closer to their original colour or no matter how much I clean it will it remain as is? would this be known as the patina? I'm having a little trouble distinguishing the difference still. I did read previously the link you included about the patina's but the coin pictured appears so smooth and green the ones that I have that are green are kind of lumpy(like little raised spots all over it).. should I try and get that off somehow?

I did get alot more detail out of another one I haven't yet posted aswell, I tried boiling them for a short period of time and then putting them into cold water it did soften some of the dirt up a little and I picked at it with a toothpick. I noticed the water smells a bit like clay when it's dirty too not that that's probably of any importance.

This is the orange rusty looking stuff I was talking about pictured below on the same GLORIA ROMANORVM previously posted. (I increased the contrast a little in the scan to try and get it closer to it's actual colour.) Still can't see or make out a mint mark, the same for the two victories looks like it's missing the part of the coin that shows it can only make out what looks like an O but it could be something else entirely.


This is the newly cleaned coin which I find rather odd, now I could be wrong... but I noticed with my other coins when you flip it from obverse to reverse vertically in your fingers the images show up the right way, however on this one it appears that when you flip it the same way the reverse image is upsidedown I'm not exactly sure what I am looking at though it looks like a soldier with a shield spearing what I think is another person.
obverse

reverse shown the way I flip all the other coins while scanning

and the way I think it might actually go if flipped horizontally

The orange coin is fine, no BD, your also correct in that the reverse does look like GLORIA ROMANORVM.




They can be stripped back to the original metal leaving them shiny but almost all collectors would consider the coin ruined at that point, if allowed to tone naturally after this they can be considered OK again but it could take decades for it to happen properly! Often on ebay you will see coins that have at some point in the distant past been well over-cleaned but have then toned naturally and many people still bid on them happily. Very few collectors could claim to have original patina on all their coins.

The patina sits between the base metal of the coin and the dirt, it is the result of the base metal reacting to outside influences in the environment it has sat before being found. The patina can be a number of different colours, brown, green and black are the most common but you can also get blue, red, sandy etc. Effectively it is the patina that has protected the coin.

It can be difficult when cleaning sometimes to tell what is dirt and what is patina, generally the patina should be tougher than the dirt on the coin and it should show about 95% of the detail that remains on the coin below. There are of course exceptions and sometimes patina can not be saved, if its disintegrating it will look like an almost 'eggshell' layer of the coin is flaking away.

Even though the patina rarely reflects the original colour of the coin it is pretty and most like it to remain on the coin.

As your just starting it will take a bit of trial and error before you understand the whole thing, everyone started like this and we have all ruined coins in the past by over-cleaning so dont stress if it happens to you .

Its also true that some coins will never, ever clean using 'soft' measures and it becomes a choice of either having a dirty, un-attributable coin or using acids or electrolysis to try and get the job done. I've used both the above with disastrous and excellent results.

Your last coin is a 'fallen horseman' type and probably of Constantius II.

https://goccf.com/t/104719

The orientation of the reverse of the coins vary, it is commonly known as 'die rotation', if you hold your coin looking at the bust with it face up and spin it on a horizontal axis and the reverse is the correct way up it is called '0 degrees rotation. If you do the same and the reverse is upside down it would be called '180 degrees rotation'.

Most coins are roughly 0 or 180, but the full 360 degrees can be found. This is due to the less than perfect manufacturing procedures used. Some coins are deliberately not 0 or 180.

ok so I know it's been a while the dirt was really tough and wouldn't budge so I got someone to use a sonicator in a laboratory for me... well now at least 6 of the 10 coins have BD lol the others possibly have it too but it's visibility is next to nothing at the moment. They came up alot better though. I read that soaking them in ammonia or deionised water would cure them. I will rescan them later today. Some have strange purple on them I'm not sure what its from, if its some kind of chemical reaction or something I couldnt find much about it besides people using toners to get different colours :s

I did a few scans, quality isn't that great... and if you were wondering the coins were put in with sodium hydrochloride? (I said to use hydroxide as I read off a site I'm not sure which was used as I was told it was a hydrochloride today but they may have just got the names mixed up or actually used the wrong thing) and deionised water and then in deionised water for a few days and then put in with some vinegar all in the sonicator over 4 days.
This is my favourite out of the lot due to its worn edges it stands out :P you should be able to see a coloured ring around the outside on both sides of the coin.