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1921-P Baffled... Help On This VAM!

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 Posted 04/16/2015  5:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add srs77 to your friends list
Ok Chute72.... I got home from work and thought, at my age, it might be a case where I'm just not seeing the scribble scratches so I sat down, got my loupe in some outside lighting and yep, indeed there is scribble scratches. I started with the VAM you attribute it to and there does appear to be scribble scratches in those locations except the ear. But they could be so shallow that I'm just not seeing them. So I think this might open pandora's box as all scribble scratches might be back in play.. Yikes! I don't believe I can pick these up in pictures but this weekend I will try. So it's off to decoding again... Thanks!
Edited by srs77
04/16/2015 5:48 pm
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 Posted 04/16/2015  5:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list
On closer inspection, I don't think it is 3DR, but I may get to the camera in about 12 hours, and if I can pick up any points, I'll share.
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 Posted 04/17/2015  8:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add srs77 to your friends list
Ok, some additional shots. First, my apology but scribble scratches are extremely difficult to try to photograph and they really don't show up well here. You'll have to take my word about it where it is specified on the shots.

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

Dont' know if any of this will help but thought I'd give it a shot.

Thanks to all who are helping me with this one.
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 Posted 04/18/2015  09:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list
This one may take a little effort, so I want to make sure we are all on the same page. First, I need to make sure that my coin is the same VAM as SRS77's.

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

Then I need to show that SRS77's is of a later die state.

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!
Then, we'll want as many eyes as possible. If you have a similar coin or are searching the data base at http://www.vamworld.com/1921-P+VAMs , you may want to be aware of these other features. Also note that lighting can change the appearance considerably.
1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!
Keep in mind that dies can change over time. So it is entirely possible that these dies were separated and re-paired, either before or after this marriage. Further, shallow scribbles can wear of, and less likely at this cracked die stage, scribbles can be added.

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!

1921-P-Baffled...--Help-On-This-VAM!
What did I miss?
Rest in Peace
United States
10625 Posts
 Posted 04/18/2015  09:31 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dave700x to your friends list
I believe you have a slightly earlier state than the op coin.

Nice pics by the way. Is that your new lens at work?
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 Posted 04/18/2015  09:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
Terrific work, Chute. You have the priorities nailed, and it sure looks like the same die pair. What's that on the wing at the end of "trust?"
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 Posted 04/18/2015  10:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list
He Chutes, he scores!...
Nice disparity of crack progression. But ya, what is that thing on the wing Shatner? Looks like it could just be a surface pattern. If it's a barwing type chip though wouldn't it show on op's lds
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 Posted 04/18/2015  11:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list
Not the new lens, hasn't arrived yet - that will be for close ups. The lens used here will actually capture a full slab.
Yes I believe this example is an earlier die state, not so cracky.
I think that wing thing was tone over dirt. then the dirt fell off. I know - could make for a real hoax.
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 Posted 04/26/2015  12:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list
I believe I have compared the coin with all possible listings and did not find a conclusive match. Some listings were certainly not this coin, and some listings were so vague I'm not sure they were talking about a silver dollar. The next step is to rely on someone with more experience than I have.
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 Posted 04/26/2015  12:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
They won't find anything you didn't, Chute. The reality is, not all Morgans can be attributed and we've found one here. The corollary is, "how much can you trust the guy who's certain?" They may be basing it on incomplete or inaccurate information themselves.

Except messydesk, of course. If what he says disagrees with what's published, you change what's published.
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 Posted 04/27/2015  07:42 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add srs77 to your friends list
Chute, I sincerely appreciate the effort you've put in on this. I have run into a brick wall here on my end as well.
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 Posted 04/27/2015  2:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list
We're not done. It needs to go to John Baumgart (mesydesk) at Variety Slabbing Services. If you are motivated, send it out and keep us informed. Or I could. I have others that need identification. Maybe I should post them here, and if they remain a mystery, I can submit several to John.
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 Posted 04/27/2015  2:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
Giving John 1921's is cruel.

If I had the money I'd buy and send him 50 which had only Scribbles for ID and sit back to contemplate him ing, but I'm like that.
Rest in Peace
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 Posted 04/27/2015  2:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add dave700x to your friends list
Your next package to VSS would come back "return to sender" un-opened.
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 Posted 04/27/2015  5:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chute72 to your friends list
Suppose I claim it's the 3FB and just start posting pictures?
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