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1802/0 1800 Reverse?

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United States
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 Posted 12/12/2010  10:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add littleboy to your friends list
It's in horrible condition and it's not a very well-known variety, so it doesn't jump out at the typical ebay browser. I guess no Half Cent specialists saw it. You should have someone who is very familiar with Half Cent die varieties to look at it.
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23522 Posts
 Posted 12/12/2010  11:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
There's only one real pickup with a coin this worn: the extra berry on the bottom right, which this coin lacks. I can *faintly* see other pickups, like the top leaves of the wreath. It's Reverse of 1800, on the surface. On the other hand, the seller's feedback indicates he goes through a fair number of early Half Cents; I can't imagine him not knowing he has a coin of which only about twenty are known.

All 1802/s share the same obverse; only one obverse die was used.

I do not know what to think of this, SC. It's like selling a raw 1894-S Barber dime on ebay just because it's holed.

Yes, if it's real, it's worth stupid money.
Rest in Peace
United States
5375 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  12:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinguybrian to your friends list
Yep. I was suspicious too but I figured I'd go for it for $500. I thought it ridiculous that this did not garner more bids and was not better presented, but hey, with $79 for a top bid I can't go wrong. Even a reverse of 1802 should be worth about $100+ in this condition, right?
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16679 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  12:57 am  Show Profile   Check vermontensium's eBay Listings Check vermontensium's eCrater Listings Bookmark this reply Add vermontensium to your friends list
I agree, if the real deal, this coin is just sick money. CDN puts @ 17,000 in G! I agree it's a gamble but after looking at it, I also would have laid some money down on it. $79 for this guy, even as beat up as he is, was a more than fair gamble ;-)
swcoin.ecrater.com
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 Posted 12/13/2010  01:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list
I'd risk $80 on that, 10 times out of ten.
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 Posted 12/13/2010  01:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jfransch to your friends list
I fear your coin is an altered date. The "2" looks all wrong. I have owned several 1802 Half Cents in the past (which I wish I had never sold but when you need money you do what you must). All the 1802s share a common obverse die on which the "2" was probably from the punch used for dimes and is significantly smaller than the other digits in the date. This "2" appears to be the same size as the other digits. Hard to tell in the photo, even blown up 400% exactly what the date looks like but I fear altered.
If this is not an altered coin, and is truly an 1802 rev of 1800 you have made the ebay score of the year.
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 Posted 12/13/2010  02:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list

Quote:
I fear your coin is an altered date. The "2" looks all wrong. I have owned several 1802 Half Cents in the past (which I wish I had never sold but when you need money you do what you must). All the 1802s share a common obverse die on which the "2" was probably from the punch used for dimes and is significantly smaller than the other digits in the date. This "2" appears to be the same size as the other digits


This is a very good point. Further, I just read the auction in detail:


Quote:
Attribution suspect here. Date appears tooled and it is impossible to discern whether the 1802 was strengthened or altered. The only certainty here is that this is a genuine Half Cent with a reverse of an 1800. On a variety that is nearly impossible to obtain, this example stands to fill in nicely and the sheer novelty aspect should make this an excellent acquisition. Although the upside is tremendous, the downside is as well. I am selling this piece AS IS so bid at your own risk.


Frankly, that changes my opinion of the whole thing.
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5375 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  02:58 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinguybrian to your friends list
What a huge failure on my part, I stopped reading at the first part because I had for some reason thought that was all there was. No wonder bids didn't go that high. On his part however, he probably should have stated it in the beginning. I probably will just cancel the transaction.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  11:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list
Frankly this would be a tempting piece just as a hole filler. At first look I was convinced that it was an 1802 C-1. Bu in looking it over closer I now think it is probabl an altered 1800. The key thing I see is the distance from the top of the 1 to the hair wave above it. On the 1802 the 1 is right up to the hair wave. On the 1800 it is significantly lower. To me the spacing on this coin seems to match the 1800.
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 Posted 12/13/2010  7:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinguybrian to your friends list
Thanks for helping me guys , I need to be much more careful about my buying. I often enter 50-100 bids into a sniping service at a time and sometimes I miss part of the description if its further down because I assume that it ended. What do you recommend that I do?
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 Posted 12/14/2010  1:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add trdhrdr007 to your friends list
If you are asking about this particular coin I'd say you should suck it up & pay what you bid.....it's not the sellers fault you missed the part about the suspect attribution. If you are asking in general I'd say you should take a few more minutes with the descriptions before you bid.
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5375 Posts
 Posted 12/14/2010  3:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinguybrian to your friends list
Isn't it verging on 'misrepresentation' to leave the 'questionable authenticity' for later? I know that if I had doubts about the authenticity of something, I'd mention it immediately. That doesn't mean I didn't make a mistake, since I've made this mistake once before and I apologized for it.
Edited by coinguybrian
12/14/2010 4:24 pm
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 Posted 12/14/2010  4:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add trdhrdr007 to your friends list
I looked at a couple of the sellers other auctions. The 2 I looked at had the exact same format : a brief description of his policies in black, followed by a description of the coin in blue, followed by other paragraphs I didn't bother to read.

If I was the seller I wouldn't have used the same title, but you can bet your bottom dollar as a buyer I would have read the entire auction before I bid. In this case you didn't have to read past the first line of the coin description.

I'm not trying to be offensive, but it appears to me that in your haste to get what appeared to be a great deal you didn't bother to do what I would consider basic due diligence, and are now looking for a reason to get out of paying.

There are lots of people that troll ebay, coin shops, antique malls, thrift shops, auctions, etc looking to use their hard won knowledge to buy something for a lot less than it's worth. I don't see anything wrong with that. In fact, that's how I make most of my living. The flip side of that is sometimes your knowledge wasn't enough, or that picture didn't really show what you thought it did, or whatever......IMO in those instances you take your lumps & move on.



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5375 Posts
 Posted 12/14/2010  4:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinguybrian to your friends list
Yeah I admit I was hasty, and probably sleepy. I buy huge amounts of coins on ebay and sometimes I skim over things. Gotta stop that. Part of the reason I'm looking to not pay is because I know I'm just going to end up returning the coin if its an altered date (which it is)
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 Posted 12/15/2010  11:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RollHunter to your friends list
Normally I'd say just pay up and eat it - there's nothing wrong with the auction listing that justifies cancelling your bid, but he does have it listed with a 7 day return despite the description saying AS IS. I'd message him with your intention to return it if it's altered and see if he agrees to cancel the winning bid to avoid the hassle.
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