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Hoarding Copper Lincolns

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Broseph's Avatar
United States
979 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  09:30 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Broseph to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
So I wanna know... why? I have just started collecting, and I have some penny rolls I am searching through and I am having a good time. I found 1911 wheat! I'm happy about that. But what about all the common copper 82s and older? I mean, there is a 10,000 fine for melting them, which makes profit there not possible. Besides, I'm no criminal.

So my question is, why do people do it? Are they hoarding them in hopes that they lift the ban? My problem is that a decent chuck of my money would be stored as pennies, and I don't have money to just put away indefinitely. going through 20$ of pennies can have quite a few dollars in copper! That would decrease how much I have to cycle in my coin hunting

Thanks for any advice!
Edited by Broseph
07/17/2012 1:28 pm
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  09:38 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No one possibly knows why some hoard items. I suspect it is part of something buried in our heads from a million years ago. Sort of like Crows that pick up anything that shines and put it in their nests. Of course many people hoard thinking some day they'll get rich on what they hoard.
Usually never works that way though. As an example way back when the Mint came up with those Bicentennial Quarters, myself and a friend went on a hoarding of those quarters thing. After over 30 years he had accumulated thousands of dollars worth and myself, close to that. At a large coin show I asked all the dealers if they wanted to buy them. The only dealer that said yes made me an offer of $0.24 each. All ended up in a local bank the next day.
Hoading Copper coins is similar. The only people making money on that is the ones already taking to a smelter and selling for Copper weight.
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Broseph's Avatar
United States
979 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  09:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Broseph to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
wow, people already melt them? I would have to think that getting caught with a 10k dollar fine would hurt their profits...
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mycrob's Avatar
United States
2602 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  10:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mycrob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
People hoard the copper cents in the hopes that once the melting ban is lifted that people will be able to sell them. Probably, such a ban would not be lifted until the abolish the cent though.
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basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  10:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Someone has to tell on you to get caught.

But you can sell them already on ebay and over places for over face value. You won't get rich doing it but it'll be free money for you especially if you think copper is going up in price.

If you already penny roll search its a no brainer to keep them. I wouldn't neccessairly say to go to banks to get pennies to do only that but if you already get pennies why not.

Its a no risk investment for people. If you can make some extra money selling them online great. If not you still have face value which is what they most likely got it for anyway.
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numismo's Avatar
United States
3039 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  11:41 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add numismo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

I've sold 5000 of them on ebay for $85 or so a couple of times. Even though I paid the postage I still made something after gathering all those cents.
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Broseph's Avatar
United States
979 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  12:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Broseph to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow, I am surprised to hear people make money on selling pennies! This is all quite interesting.... Guess I should continue keeping them.
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bpoc1's Avatar
United States
4078 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  12:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bpoc1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
But what about all the common copper 82-s?

Reminder, not all 82's are copper. Some are Copper-Plated Zinc.
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billymac11's Avatar
United States
613 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  12:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add billymac11 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
maybe the question is, is there anything that can be done to encourage people to "un-hoard" their cents short of destruction through melt? Get those hoards back into the wild!
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tmaring's Avatar
United States
88 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  12:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tmaring to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
On melting:
The ban on melting is NOT a law passed by congress, but a treasury department "rule". It is designed to suppress massive mining of the penny stock by such operators as Brinks and Wells Fargo etc. who could conceivably strip so many from circulation in so short a time as to disrupt commerce by making change scarce. Copper pennies are of course not pure copper, but contain 5% zinc. This makes recycling to a smelter awkward because you'd have to go through a refining process first to get rid of the zinc. It's just not worth it. But... nobody much cares about backyard melting.

Let's say that you are a metal artist and specialize in making brass plaques for statues or graves etc. If you go to the commercial sector to purchase brass to melt, you'll pay something on the order of a 50%+ premium over the melt value of the metal. But... if you do a bit of math you can calculate how many copper and zinc pennies it will take to create the brass alloy you need... and if you are getting those pennies at face value you're getting them at less than the melt value.

And people are doing that all the time! It's no big deal... a few pounds here a few pounds there. The treasury doesn't care about small time stuff. It's the legal equivalent of jaywalking on a deserted street.
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Broseph's Avatar
United States
979 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  1:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Broseph to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
bpoc1, I am aware of that, and I do not keep 82s. I meant 82- as in 82 minus, just to clarify, I realize I may have been confusing and I am going to edit the original post
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
187702 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  5:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The ban on melting is NOT a law passed by congress, but a treasury department "rule".
I never knew this, but it appears that you are correct.

Regardless, there is no need to melt them, they are easily sold and traded as bullion now.
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basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  6:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
maybe the question is, is there anything that can be done to encourage people to "un-hoard" their cents short of destruction through melt? Get those hoards back into the wild!


The only real way would be for copper to fall so low and stay there for a while that the face value is higher than the melt value taking away the incentive of saving them up.
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M0nks's Avatar
United States
1770 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  9:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add M0nks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
ive been hoarding them for yrs, since I was a kid I've hoarded them ( I also seem to have hoarded the early zincs as well forgot I had 10 coffee cans filled with the early zincs) most of those early zincs are almost uncirculated and we all know how fast the zincs turn
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tgauchsin's Avatar
United States
344 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  10:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tgauchsin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Why? Why not? It doesn't cost me anything and it's forgotten money. If I left the money in the bank, I would get very little interest. If I ever am in dire straights, I could cash them in.
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hammerrob's Avatar
United States
98 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2012  11:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hammerrob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Most believe that two forces are at work: 1) US dollar is being rapidly debased meaning you should want to hold hard assets 2) Copper prices should continue to trend up due to pressure from the modernizing 3rd world.

I'm on board with #2, and have trouble refuting #1 .... anyway, if the price of copper goes up through some combination of those two forces, the premium people will be willing to pay for these cents will go up too (even if melt ban is never lifted).

So couple that with hunting for wheats and the no-downside risk aspect ...
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