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Help With Kwang Tung 7 Mace Coin

 
 
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New Member

United States
4 Posts
 Posted 04/12/2016  09:06 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Real One to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I have researched online for information about this coin and found a large value difference depending on auction and selling. I am uploading the photos for review. Here are the facts at this point.
The coin is not magnetic, it measures 39.5 mm diameter, 2.5 mm thick, image is head to head. It weights 26.3+ grams on a non calibrated scale.
I bought in a small village while living in China. I have read there are a lot of fake coins like this out there. Just trying to get an idea of what this coin might be for future value.
Thanks for your help,



Pillar of the Community
Australia
3151 Posts
 Posted 04/12/2016  11:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gxseries to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not too sure which side to lean on at the moment. Diagnosis and weight seems to be ok however you are dealing with Chinese coins and I have to be more bias.

Can you please post a photo of the edge?
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseries

My numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htm Regularly updated at least once a month.
New Member
United States
4 Posts
 Posted 04/14/2016  09:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Real One to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Uploading edge photo, it is grooved (not sure of correct description)and sharp

Pillar of the Community
Australia
3151 Posts
 Posted 04/14/2016  10:47 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gxseries to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm leaning towards a super counterfeit. Weight wise, it's a bit underweight if it's from Kwangtung Province and in XF+ condition. It should be around the 26.7g. I can somewhat understand if it's within +- 0.1g but 26.3g is probably a worrying sign. The edge is actually a bit too razor sharp which was technically not possible during that era.

Better photo would be nicer - I could be very mistaken.

It would be best to send it for authenticity test to either NGC or PCGS as it is somewhat valuable in this condition (if genuine). While it is still easy to diagnosis terrible copies it's just very difficult judge super counterfeits from images these days.
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseries

My numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htm Regularly updated at least once a month.
New Member
United States
4 Posts
 Posted 04/14/2016  6:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Real One to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Appreciate your help with this coin; I am going to a local coin dealer to get additional opinion. In the meantime I have uploaded new (hopefully better) photos to help any who are replying.





Pillar of the Community
Australia
3151 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2016  09:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gxseries to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the photos.

The newer photos still gives me the impression that this is one of the newer types of super counterfeits that appeared in the market within the last 5 years. The edge is the giveaway sign and the luster is also another sign. Again I could be very mistaken but it doesn't hurt to seek for further advice.
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseries

My numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htm Regularly updated at least once a month.
New Member
United States
4 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2016  11:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Real One to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the help, gives me more information about how and where I purchased the coin. It was about 14 to 15 years ago from a old Chinese man, not a market or tourist venue. I was looking for something with a dragon on it at the time.
Pillar of the Community
Australia
3151 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2016  02:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gxseries to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It would still be best to submit to a TPG for authenticity. I decided to give it a proper research before making any further comments and found this to be of interest:

https://www.NGCcoin.com/news/viewar...ticleID=3525

I was not aware of the differences and I guess you learn new things every day. I do own one but it is of the more common Kwangtung mint instead of the scarcer Heaton mint. Yours seem to resemble the Heaton mint and hence will most likely have different diagnostics.

I really do not believe a local coin dealer will have enough experience to tell the difference unless he / she is well versed with Chinese numismatics. I acknowledge that submitting to TPG will cost a fair bit but if proven to be genuine and if it is indeed from Heaton mint, you might have a gem there!
My partial coin collection http://www.omnicoin.com/collection/gxseries

My numismatics articles and collection: http://www.gxseries.com/numis/numis_index.htm Regularly updated at least once a month.
Valued Member
United States
235 Posts
 Posted 05/10/2016  10:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add PatAR to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the forum and thank you for posting your coin!



While I am not an expert in this particular series, I do see a number of signs that concern me.

Compared with a known authentic Heaton example (available online at auction house archives, etc) several areas of the dragon such as snout, the shoulder of the leg below and left of the mouth, and the scales in general seem to lack detail.

Portions of the P and E in PROVINCE and C and E in CANDAREENS are missing. Portions that should not be missing from an authentic coin since there is no other evidence of a worn die, die crack, etc.

I believe it is a forgery.
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