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Heritage Auctions has become the dump

 
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2853 Posts
 Posted 03/21/2018  10:36 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add MikeF to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I'm not sure if it's the rate hikes but over the last 4 months I have seen the quality of coins offered by Heritage rapidly decline.

IMO it's become the dumping ground for cleaned coins, coins lacking eye appeal, and doctored coins that somehow made their way into problem-free holders.

If your lucky enough to actually find a coin with eye appeal, their starved customer base runs them up to ridiculous price levels.

Has anyone else noticed this?
Hi, my name is MikeF and I'm a degenerate coin collector. I also like adventure, big trucks, long walks on the beach and the Kansas City Chiefs.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1106 Posts
 Posted 03/21/2018  10:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hadleydog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To be honest, I have always found Heritage a dumping ground for problem coins. Not as bad as eBay, but always had their fair share.
The market for better coins is becoming fairly strong, and nice pieces are not showing up anywhere as new collectors entering the market are just not selling.
Perhaps what you are seeing is just a lack of the desirable coins in their auctions, while the amount of dreck remains the same.
And yes, collectors are starved for the desirable pieces, and their prices are certainly on the rise.
Edited by hadleydog
03/21/2018 10:57 pm
Pillar of the Community
Canada
556 Posts
 Posted 03/21/2018  11:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Optimist-numismatist to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To be honest I have even seen this here in Canada, do either of You think it could possibly be that the collector numbers are higher these days to the point where the are not enough coins to supply the demand?
Pillar of the Community
United States
2115 Posts
 Posted 03/21/2018  11:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Slider23 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The market is strong for scarce coins that are high end of grade with eye appeal.

It appears that Great Collections is taking a bigger slice of the weekly auction market since the Heritage rate increase.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1106 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  12:05 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hadleydog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The market is strong for scarce coins that are high end of grade with eye appeal.

Exactly.
And a lot of those coins are in strong hands, and we are not seeing them for sale.
Even Legend is having a hard time finding new pieces, and the ones they do post are often gone within a few hours.....often before the images are even posted.

Quote:
it could possibly be that the collector numbers are higher these days to the point where the are not enough coins to supply the demand?

I could be wrong, but I believe it to be more what the new collectors are acquiring. Not as many are looking to fill holes in their albums, more are looking for the high end pieces and putting them away.
Edited by hadleydog
03/22/2018 12:07 am
Pillar of the Community
United States
655 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  12:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ron6788 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, Mike, there are tons of problem coins out there. In fact, I used to collect them as a subtype. (If you can't beat 'em, join 'em.) But that was years ago, so I haven't noticed any big uptick in this, just about the same- at least for the series I follow. Maybe, the stuff you follow has had an increase in junk offerings lately.

One thing I'd say in HA's defense is that they are strictly above-board. The problem coins offered are meticulously photographed and are in holders that spell out the trouble. Also, prices are usually in line with the issues. This is unlike eBay where it's like the wild West, with coins routinely cracked out of problem holders and sold as straight-grades.

I've a separate bone to pick with HA, though. Last year, they upped their commission to 20%, as the regulars know, and, this year, they're forcing me to pay sales tax, besides. It's really putting me at a disadvantage in bidding because I have to keep adding 7% to my tally.
Bedrock of the Community
Australia
14465 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  03:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The market is much more strongly driven by the buyers and sellers, than by the auctioneers. The quality of better items is entirely due to their availability, driven by the buyers and sellers.

The only, and much less influence that the auctioneers have,
is with their fees, and their ability to make it easier to buy and sell.

Low individual value coins are almost always sold in lots of multiple coins.
Bedrock of the Community
Learn More...
United States
15716 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  08:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
#1 - Heritage, #2 - Great Collections, #3 - Stacks, Bowers.

If you can't find enough great coins at those three top rated auction houses, you must be seriously rich.

Or your want list is too small. One of the two.

Huge number of gorgeous coins in addition to not-so-nice crud.

Prices are significantly stronger the last 16-18 months on key type.

Some specific coins have doubled in the last year.

Heritage, the company you mention, has the best customer service of ANY company I've ever worked with. Not just in coins but for ANY company type.

Three minor problems were taken care of by the person who answered the phone in one minute, ALWAYS in the customers favor.

They no longer require payment from me before shipping. They ship my order first day possible, even if the invoice isn't paid.

I only WISH Mediacom was a tenth as good as Heritage.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14322 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  12:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
and, this year, they're forcing me to pay sales tax, besides. It's really putting me at a disadvantage in bidding because I have to keep adding 7% to my tally.


If you live in California and Texas or New York, you should've been paying sales tax for years. Heritage has nexus and all three of those states. You want to get around the sales tax have the coins delivered to a different state. Or if you live in California make sure your purchases are over $1500.
Gary Schmidt
Bedrock of the Community
United States
10891 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  2:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
MO it's become the dumping ground for cleaned coins, coins lacking eye appeal, and doctored coins that somehow made their way into problem-free holders.


Some of that is their picture style, but some of it is that they can get those cheap to sell. There's a bigger dumping ground than them in the true sense of the word, but that type of material is also the most likely to end up getting sold a lot instead of staying in a collection.


Quote:
I could be wrong, but I believe it to be more what the new collectors are acquiring. Not as many are looking to fill holes in their albums, more are looking for the high end pieces and putting them away


Exactly this. The best stuff is getting tucked away for long periods. A lot of the old "keys" have been exposed and more collectors just get what they want and date sets seem to be fading out some.

Valued Member
United States
335 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  5:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Heymikep to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I believe that it is because there have been a steady rise of new and/or re-entering the market for coin collecting. I am not saying that the new collector is getting the higher quality coins yet because it takes time for a collector to warm up (or become knowledgeable) to the higher value higher quality coins. I started collecting about 10 years ago and I would buy ANY condition coin to fill a hole in the set I was collecting. As time has gone on I am starting to be more careful and selective in what I buy or what I can find to buy! When I started I could not see spending more than $25-$50 on a coin, I could not comprehend someone buying a coin for $3k-$5k or more. As my knowledge of coin collecting has grown I completely understand the value and why someone would spend that much. I have noticed that there has been a huge decrease in available coins in the market in auction houses and websites that sell coins.
Pillar of the Community
United States
2853 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  9:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MikeF to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
If you can't find enough great coins at those three top rated auction houses, you must be seriously rich.

Or your want list is too small. One of the two.


Or #3, your too dam picky.

But seriously though, I have seen a decline in quality that is Heritage-specific. Have you seen the selection of coins for the upcoming dallas show? Now, they cut out sunday night auctions and combined them with Tuesday weekly auctions and it's the same deal with those. Nothing but junk for the series I follow.

You used to be able to find a few stunners at least once a week. No more.
Hi, my name is MikeF and I'm a degenerate coin collector. I also like adventure, big trucks, long walks on the beach and the Kansas City Chiefs.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
10891 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  9:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:

You used to be able to find a few stunners at least once a week. No more.


How is that their fault in any way
Pillar of the Community
United States
2853 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  9:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MikeF to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's not. Unless the higher fees are steering higher end coins elsewhere. I have noticed a considerable difference in the last four months and I watch all auction sites like a hawk.
Hi, my name is MikeF and I'm a degenerate coin collector. I also like adventure, big trucks, long walks on the beach and the Kansas City Chiefs.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
10891 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  10:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Unless the higher fees are steering higher end coins elsewhere.


It's not unless they had an internal change on what they would make a deal on. They should give the sane percentage no matter what the fee
Pillar of the Community
United States
1302 Posts
 Posted 03/22/2018  11:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kbbpll to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I haven't noticed this. I really only focus on Canadian George V and VI silver and have scanned through every Heritage world coin auction pretty religiously for the last 5-10 years. So since this is posted in US Classic I wonder if it's just specific categories. Sure, there's always a few MS64s that look more like 62, but that's the TPG's fault not the auction house. My thought is that the economy has been pretty good for a few years now and maybe the general US trend is that collectors have upgraded and are dumping their less desirable coins.
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