I would suggest that Julian - a dealer I have known, respected and trusted for 20+ years - is keying in on the sharpness of detail found on the coin (e.g., the sails and ship rigging). Such a level of sharpness is not generally seen on MS coins.
I have seen too many "mistakes" made by grading companies over the years to have blind faith in their opinions. They get it correct the vast majoirty of times, but not always. Julian has seen many coins over his long career, I wouldn't casually dismiss his opinion without seeing the coin in hand with my own eyes.
I look forward to any inside insights that can be provided by GrapeCollects.
Collecting history one coin or medal at a time! (c) commems. All rights reserved.
Quote: , Grapes can comment on this one, as he works for Julian
Quote: is keying in on the sharpness of detail found on the coin (e.g., the sails and ship rigging). Such a level of sharpness is not generally seen on MS coins.
Quote: I look forward to any inside insights that can be provided by GrapeCollects.
Hello, I'll provide what insight I can.
Julian, myself and our manager all agree that this is a proof coin. As commems indicated the details of the devices, sharpness of the denticles, and mirror like fields is what lead us to believe it is a proof. Given that I know you well enough, I could arrange for you to see it in hand if you'd like.
Quote: but for $20k, I would like to have an appropriately labeled holder.
We've discussed this with him on many, many occasions. Julian is old fashioned. While he gets the point of TPGs he's not a huge fan. He'd rather keep it in the current holder and wait for a buyer I guess.
Quote: the fact that a polished coin will probably have mirror-like fields, proof or not.
I also think it's worth mentioning that I'm not trying to justify everything for him. I've criticized him many times before. The guy isn't flawless.
same seller for all 3... I dunno seems a bit pricey. For $15 - $20K I'd think I'd want it straight graded, or called a proof at the very least on the label. My guess is with them being cleaned or polished, the Third party graders are reluctant to call it "proof surfaces" anymore even if it is a proof strike.
It sure looks like a proof to me. I'm not a fan of what much of the 3rd party grading services do, but this isn't a coin that I'd buy without it being certified as proof. I think it will be a hard sell. That said, I'm betting the dealer bought it in the holder and is simply reselling it with full disclosure that he disagrees with the grade. You've got to respect that.
Quote: I think I would crack it out and resubmit it.
We've had this talk. He refers to himself as Mr.Krabs from spongebob due to his dislike of spending money.
Quote: That said, I'm betting the dealer bought it in the holder and is simply reselling it with full disclosure that he disagrees with the grade. You've got to respect that.
Actually we received this in part of a collection years back, a few before I even started at the shop. The collection was mainly consisted of high grade classic commemorative coins and had many of them in both mint state and proof. The coins were all purchased outright and most have sold with the exception of a few proofs and an Isabella quarter, of course not including this.