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1940 S Lincoln Wheat Cent Pre Cud On Reverse L Wheat Stalk

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 Posted 11/20/2022  8:22 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add KyWahine to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Thanks to @-makecents- for the link... http://cuds-on-coins.com/lincoln-ce...-cuds-1940s/ that pointed me in the right direction for this LWC.
It's pretty cool to find something that I can see on line.

If this was a full on cud, would the metal cover all the area between the pre-cud and the rim breaks?



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 Posted 11/20/2022  8:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It would and more than likely, more. Did you find any that looked like yours? That's part of the learning process.
-makecents-
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 Posted 11/20/2022  8:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Difficult for me to see what you're referring to.



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 Posted 11/20/2022  9:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add KyWahine to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are so many varieties that were noted, but I did find one picture where the pre-cud extended down near the bottom of the wheat stalk closer to the stem that is similar to my coin. It didn't have a cross reference and it was titled: PC 1c 1940S 70R. I still haven't found out what the 70R stands for. Do you know @-makecents-?
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 Posted 11/20/2022  9:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add KyWahine to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Maybe this link will work better. The picture is pretty far into the page.
https://www.coincommunity.com/go/li...-cuds-1940s/
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 Posted 11/20/2022  9:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hmm not sure that is a good match @kyw, but to be honest I'm not seeing a cud which seems to be a better match. Maybe this die was replaced in time before that chunk actually fell off and it started striking cuds?
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 Posted 11/20/2022  10:09 pm  Show Profile   Check robbudo's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add robbudo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Whether the 70R is the right one or not, it's the 70th one known for the year! The R tacked onto the end denotes that the cud/retained cud is simply on the Reverse.
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 Posted 11/21/2022  08:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
KyWahine, this may be a long shot but check out PC-1c-1940S-16 Stage A & 17R. The pics were a little tough to work with and I'm not for sure on this but your reverse pre-cud looks pretty dang close and your mint mark location is too. If this is the right listing, you may have an earlier stage than what is shown. The listing I gave you above, to check out, also has an obverse pre-cud but cannot make out whether you have a crack there or not. See if you can get us a nice, clear, closeup of the area they show, at the base of the obverse, on this listing.



-makecents-
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 Posted 11/21/2022  09:10 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I did a side by side of yours and the PC-1c-1940S-70R listing that you suggested. It's pretty close, as are the mint mark locations. Nice job on picking this one out of the many listings. Please check the obverse of the other listing though and see what you come up with.


-makecents-
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 Posted 11/21/2022  1:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just a die crack and a die chip on the affected area. A retained cud is when the metal on the die is no longer in the correct alignment:
Retained cuds:







So without the movement of the die, it is just a die crack/break issue. More coins later it maybe develop into one, but when your coin was struck, it hadn't happened yet.


CoopHome: What is the difference between die cracks and retain cuds on coins? that die area will move, altering the die coins struck with that die. this happens as the die crack gets so deep into the die, that a separation of the areas are affected. eventually when the die breaks away, then it will be a full cud.
Richard S. Cooper
Some have asked about my images I use and I'm glad to say, you can now you can see the DVD in sections on youtube:
1. Intro, older coins, toned coins 2. Doubled dies 3. Die events, One of a kind errors 4. So called errors, Coin information 5. Coin information Types and Varieties, Overlays
Jefferson nickel doubled dies Wexler/Rebar complete listings

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 Posted 11/21/2022  5:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You do not like the new "Pre-Cud", categorization, do you, coop.
-makecents-
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 Posted 11/21/2022  10:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add KyWahine to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow.. thank you for all the good information on the retained die cuds, coop. I'm starting to get a clearer picture of how the die breaks occur. Your pictures and illustrations are fabulous, and to the point.

Thank you Robbudo for the info on the 70R.

@-makecents- ... I didn't think it was PC-1c-1940S-16 Stage A & 17R, because I was looking for a good sized die break on the obverse like the picture, and didn't see one. And PC 1c 1940S 70R sure seems like a good fit too. However, after looking closer at the obverse like you suggested, there is a very small hairline break on the obverse.
It's faint but it's there.





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 Posted 11/21/2022  11:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add silviosi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Congrat Dear for your mathusalem year of 12K.
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 Posted 11/22/2022  06:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the extra pics, KyWahine. In the future, always try to orient the pics in the same way as the listing, when trying to compare. I know you have to do odd pics sometimes to capture what you are trying to see but you can do this by moving your lighting too and not the coin.

That being said, it looks close but cannot tell for sure, because of orientation. A cool find, non the less.
-makecents-
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 Posted 11/22/2022  6:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add KyWahine to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
on your pic advice... -makecents-. And Mahalo for all the help on this coin. The side by side photos were helpful.
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