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 Replies: 13 / Views: 1,923 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
548 Posts |
Yeah, yeah, being a scrap gold dealer I know the difference in silver content for the various U.S. coins.
10 dime, 4 quarters and 2 halves contain 0.723 ounces of silver.
But a silver dollar (Morgan, Peace) contains 0.7734 ounces.
Seems to me the U.S. mint was pretty smart making the dimes, quarters and halves act so "decimally."
Why didn't they do that with the dollars? Anyone know the historical basis for the silver content of these coins?
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Moderator
 United States
187702 Posts |
Sap answered this back in June... https://goccf.com/t/92055#763823Quote:
It's all to do with seigniorage - the difference between a coin's face value and the cost that went in to making it (total costs, which include refining and assaying the metal, making the dies and making the blanks, and labour costs), which is booked as profit earned by the government. And it's not that the dollar is "too heavy", rather it's all the other coins that are "too light".
If you've got a "dollar's worth of silver" to be turned into coins, it costs more to make four quarters or ten dimes out of it than it costs to make a single large dollar - more blanks need to be punched out, more time on the coin press, more dies need to be made, more labour costs. To make up this extra cost (and to keep the production of the smaller coins profitable), smaller coins contain slightly less silver than the larger coins compared to what they "should have".
In the Latin Monetary Union coinage standard (used by most of continental Europe prior to World War I), we see the same effect, although there it is the fineness of the largest coin that is higher, rather than the weight - a large 5 francs coin weighs exactly the same as five small 1 franc coins, but the 5 franc coin is .900 fine silver, while the 1 franc coins are only .835 fine. |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
548 Posts |
Thanks, Buck.
I'd done a search, but couldn't think of the search terms to use to find the info. I was certain it had been discussed before.
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Moderator
United States
187702 Posts |
Do not feel bad, I had to search twice to find it.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5854 Posts |
I was thinking of a different explanation for the difference in ASW. I was thinking that it went back to 1853 when they decreased the weights of the Half Dime, dime, quarter, and half dollar. Before the devaluation, I think all those denominations and the dollar all had the correct proportion of silver. The change in weights was probably due to the rising price of silver relative to gold as a result of the California gold rush. Now why they didn't change the weight of the silver dollar I wasn't really sure so I decided to do a google search and on wikipedia found what might be a possible explanation. On that page it said that R.W Julian thought that it was due to "its status as the 'flagship' of American coins." Also, if I remember correctly, I think many Seated dollars were used as trade coins so I guess it might make sense to not devalue it. Edited by D0ubl3Eagle
11/15/2011 8:13 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
548 Posts |
Ah, Double Eagle. Now look what you've done. You're gonna make me open a book and read. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1801 Posts |
We should all be thankful for that small variance in silver content between the dollar coin and the minor coins. It is the reason we have so many beautiful uncirculated silver dollars to collect. Begining in 1878 the mint was ordered to purchase enormous amounts of silver from the western silver producing states to support the price of silver and coin it into silver coin. Way more silver than was needed for commerce. So in order to do it in the most efficient manner the mint decided to coin millions of silver dollars that no one wanted and just store them away in the treasury vaults. They became a virtual treasure trove in the 1960's when it was discovered that mint sealed bags of rare silver dollars were on hand and could be bought for face value at the treasury. It set off the great silver dollar coin rush that ended with the GSA sale of the remaining (mostly CC mint) dollars through mail order auctions.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
666 Posts |
Don't the Trade dollars have more silver in them than the other silver dollars? |
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Valued Member
United States
187 Posts |
Trade dollars contain .7874 oz. of silver....silver dollars contain .77344 oz. of silver.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
double eagle has the correct reason. Quote:
We should all be thankful for that small variance in silver content between the dollar coin and the minor coins. We would have had all those silver dollars whether there was a variance in the weights or not. |
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Valued Member
United States
257 Posts |
Learn something new every day!
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Valued Member
United States
326 Posts |
I agree. It is really cool to learn this stuff about our coins.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
548 Posts |
Well, I'm sorta weird in the way I look at silver (and gold) concentrations in coins and jewelry. Being a chemical engineer, I look at this as a chemistry issue. Buying (and selling, for that matter) coins on a multiple of face value seems strange to me.  I generally just weigh the coins, multiply by 90% to obtain the silver content, and then pay (or receive, in the case of a sale) based on a fraction of spot. This method works irrespective of dollars vs dimes, if you know what I mean. But I was curious.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5854 Posts |
I think the buying a selling of U.S 90% silver is done on a multiple of face because of convenience. Since the dime, quarter, and half dollar have proportion amounts of silver, it is much easier to add up the face value of and then multiply by some multiple to get the silver value than it is to weight the coins and then go through several calculations in order to figure out the silver value. The method that you mention becomes more problematic when you have very large transactions. Also it is easier for the dealer to quote a price when the exact quantity is not known. The method that you mention will work for just about anything as long as the composition is known and I used a similar method on many occasions usually for jewelry.
Edited by D0ubl3Eagle
11/16/2011 2:00 pm
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Replies: 13 / Views: 1,923 |
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Posted 11/15/2011 4:30 pm
