| Author |
Replies: 4,802 / Views: 394,486 |
|
|
|
Valued Member
United States
455 Posts |
I'm not going to buy them either. I just thought that with the cost of the grading service, it made them seem a little more reasonable and thought I'd point them out in case anyone was interested.
Thanks.
|
|
Valued Member
United States
194 Posts |
Always glad to hear new info, and I think you're close on the grading cost. Those bullion should cost about $175 raw, and NGC has been offering free upgrade for oversize pucks. So with the basic grade cost plus shipping, etc...there ya go, $229. And yet, that's still overpriced ;)
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
2764 Posts |
Just a little note: MS69 is the highest grade for any bullion 5oz ATB. It may be worth it for those try to build a set of ATB 5oz in MS69. I recalled in 2011-2012, these same coins cost in the range of $300-$400, so this is a good time to buy these coins, IF you are into MS69 thing. From the perspective of bullion collectors then it would NOT make any sense to buy these when you can get the raw ATB coins for spot + $2/oz or + $3/oz (spot price for 5oz + $10 to $15) from those big online retailer.
|
|
Valued Member
United States
194 Posts |
I would add the proviso that MS69PL and MS69DMPL are considered higher by certain buyers, and the prices reflect that.
ETA: in 2012 I bought and sold a Glacier in FS MS69DMPL, and pricing both ways was right around $200. I would definitely not chase that particular piece.
Edited by Clint 02/14/2013 1:36 pm
|
|
Valued Member
United States
135 Posts |
So with spot being $30 plus $2-3oz, that would make a raw coin $165-175. Which Big retailers are selling them that cheap? The best I can find is usually 190 at the least, I may not be finding the best sites to buy from. Plus then you have to add shipping, now I would love to find a "big retailer" that's selling these at $165-175 with free shipping. Anyone know of a site that has the best prices/free or low cost shipping? Please post it cause I wouldn't mind picking up a few that I'm missing. All mine are graded so far, and I usually try and go for the Ms69 DMPL.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote: The bullion were tied to spot from what I understand when first sold. With maybe a few exceptions they are basically just tied to spot with a normal premium attached. Quote: I just thought that with the cost of the grading service, it made them seem a little more reasonable The pucks are especially brutal on the wallet to get graded. Id strongly suggest people buy them already graded and let someone else worry about the grading cost if thats what people want. Quote: Which Big retailers are selling them that cheap? You might be looking at the P versions which arent bullion. Provident Metals is selling the ones they have in stock of the bullion for 170 something.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
I wouldn't be so fast to call the 2012 bullion pucks "bullion" anymore. Just try to find the last three at any of the APs for $175. APMEX has them around for $197, $312, & $197. El Yunque and Chaco can still be found @ $175, but that won't last either, I believe they will all acquire some premium over that of bullion. As a matter of fact, Provident is all out of 2012s, they are scarce and will only get harder to find for a decent price as time goes by.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
899 Posts |
@Bizybackson They are still bullion pucks. It is typical to see most products jump in demand and price once the known quantity of them is limited, and then settle down to market price after the dust settles. (check the 1999 silver mint set - which had for years been sold way over the initial value and is now settling). Granted these may always get above spot values for silver, simply because they are unique, but many of us wouldn't buy them at anything over spot. I personally would rather tie my money up in smaller pieces of silver, and don't see these as value added enough to spend $10 an ounce or more over spot. Even the Provident site listed above is offering near spot to buy them from you, so they can resell them for a couple of dollars an ounce over that price.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
593 Posts |
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
I hope more people consider the 5oz pucks as just bullion. Lots of resellers have noticed how hard it is to find the Acadia (25,400 pieces) and Denali (20,000 pieces) and are pricing them accordingly around $225-$250 per RAW coin. This was the same situation for Volcanoes a month ago and gone up to the $300 level, a 'bullion' coin containing $150 worth of silver. Those in the know are quietly buying them up and trying to avoid a steep premium.
Yes, please keep on considering these coins as bullion, please! Keeps the prices low and affordable. Finished my 2nd set of 2012 with very decent DMPL coins, so waiting for the 2013s. Hopefully any day now.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
899 Posts |
*winks* glad you know! Buying is great - selling is where the money is. They sold in limited quatities, because there was a limited demand for 5 ounces of bullion coins. The market is still pretty weak for them, reguardless of your expressed interest. They had a hard time selling the 2011 and still list most of the 2012 on the mints website and they still haven't issued the already late 2013 1st coin. Granted they may be a huge profit maker for you and are currently for people selling but once the dust settles... they are 5 ounce bullion grade silver.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
2764 Posts |
Both Bizybackson and Doug58s, each have their own point; one will come out on top.... we just have to wait and see in a few year. If the 5oz ATB goes the way that the First Spouse then Doug58s may have some relevant argument (as we see lower and lower # of sales of the First Spouse). However, the main culprit of the decline of sales of the First Spouse series is the COST (gold had been doubled in 5yrs, since 2007, so it cost 2x as much to collect the coin). So, if in 5yrs, silver price double...... OR if silver price goes down to below $20/oz, we will see sales picking up. However, at this moment, I'm a little more on Bizybackson's side, with the assumption that demand will leveling off and I suspect that silver will not double in 5yrs (even though silver will increase against USD, probably 25% to 50%). Why? Because the market is being controlled by paper silver, not physical silver. I hope I'm wrong and the price will double or more so we all should be able to retain the buying power of some of our asset (those stored in PM). Time will tell.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote: However, the main culprit of the decline of sales of the First Spouse series is the COST (gold had been doubled in 5yrs, since 2007, so it cost 2x as much to collect the coin). The one difference I see between the two is that these have been much more mismanaged. The premiums have been very high at times and they just never really release any information about them. Their release timing was pretty bad last year two mixing them in with a glut of other silver products. I personally believe that cost them a fair amount of sales. One you pass on one of them and the series is no longer complete it becomes easier and easier to put off buying the rest or just stopping all together when the catching up you need to do gets to cost prohibitive. Itll be interesting to see how these play out. The Hawaii did have a spike but I think thats more of an isolated incident so far. Id say if you like them get them, but this wouldnt be something I would pick to load up on to flip at a later date
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
NQ2-Acadia officially sold out today. Yesterday's mint sales report put them right around Hawaii @ 14,716. Let see how that affects the premium on the Hawaii coin, and if one rises to 3x issue price?
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1285 Posts |
The issue I see here is that some of the Hawaii premy is due to speculators. For instance the day after it was sold out you could get them on ebay for around $300. Today they are pushing 500 plus...lets.. Think about it for a second IF the ebay buyers were true collector's they could have bought it at 249 or less from the mint. The Hawaii coin reminds me of the nutty behavior of the 2010 bullion and mint versions. Part of the issue is that most LCS do not want these coins. Why? They can flip ASE's all day long back and forth for a $3 profit. They can do that 20 to 30 times in a week rather than a coin that takes 1 or more months to sell. Be patient...and pick off the coins you want / need for the sets at your max price. As usual...my 2 cents.
|
| |
Replies: 4,802 / Views: 394,486 |