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Here Is What I Would Do For The Coin "Problem"

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n9jig's Avatar
United States
997 Posts
 Posted 03/10/2012  09:40 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add n9jig to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
OK, we all know the problems with current coinage. The penny and nickel cost more to make then they are worth and the penny really doesn't circulate, it is received in change and gets tossed in jars and cans and eventually returned to CoinStar or the bank to be rerolled and reused.

Dimes haven't been changed in 65 years except for the 1965 composition change.

Quarters are the basic unit of coins these days and, while the State Quarters were successful, the Parks quarters have not captured the imagination of the public nearly as much.

Halves and dollars are all but unused. I dropped a couple Golden Dollars at the grocery the other day and thought the clerk was going to call the police since he thought they were fake. When is the last time you got a half dollar in change?

Metal content has no bearing on coin value these days, the metal in a nickel is worth more than that of a dime... The dollar coin is smaller than a half dollar, the dime smaller than the nickel and cent.

I often thought a devalue by a factor of 10 would solve the coinage problem, the cent would actually become useful again as well as the other small coins. While I still think that would work, it would be quite a shock to the country. We could instead reevaluate the coinage and create new size coins that more accurately reflect the relative values.

Without revaluing the Dollar how about this:

A new Cent would be slightly smaller than a current dime with a holed center and copper color.

The new 5 cent piece would be slightly larger than the current dime and the same copper color as the new cent.

There would be no need for a 10 cent piece in my scheme.

The quarter would be made of the same nickel-copper mix (25/75%) as the current nickel and be slightly larger than the new 5 cent piece but perhaps a little thinner.

Eliminate the 50 cent piece.

The new dollar coin would be about the size of the current quarter (sized differently to let machines differentiate them). It would be the same nickel-copper composition as the current nickel.

The 2 dollar coin would be a bit larger than the new dollar coin, perhaps bi-metallic like the Twoonie.

There would only be two metal compositions, copper coated zinc for the cents and 5 cent pieces as well as the center of the new $2 coin. 75% copper/25% nickel would be used for the 25 cent coin as well as the dollar and outer part of the $2 coins.

Size would then become more relevant to fiat value of the coins, this would help satisfy advocates for the blind and my own self indulgence.
Metal compositions would be simplified and the ugly clad sandwiches would be gone.
Magnets can still be used to weed out the evil foreign coins in counters and vending machines.
Only 5 coins would be needed to satisfy small value commerce and the paper dollar can be eliminated.

As for designs, I would change the reverse every 5 years. Have each denomination assigned a theme and let the reverses change to follow that theme. Instead of dead presidents and statesmen on the obverse go back to the Liberty images of olde.

I know the vending machine industry has a lot of say in coin size and composition matters but these days more and more vending machines take paper and plastic so that influence is less and less all the time.

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DM1975's Avatar
United States
284 Posts
 Posted 03/10/2012  09:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DM1975 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Huh? Half dollars haven't been made for circulation in years, just mint and proof sets have them. National Parks quarters have not been put into circulation in the way the State Quarters were so they are scarce in circulation, not that they haven't caught the imagination of anyone, in fact most people that I know who collect prefer their designs to the State Quarters. And why the hole in the cent? And why no dime? What is the reasoning behind these changes?

Wouldn't it be easier to just change completion instead of forcing people to learn a whole new coinage system?
Bedrock of the Community
United States
10284 Posts
 Posted 03/10/2012  10:10 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TNG to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The cent coin no matter what it is made of would cost more than 1 cent to make. I think there's enough coinage laying around for commerce. Only proof coins and mint sets should be made for collectors from here on out until the need for currency is replaced with electronic money. This is going to happen.
Stop printing $1.00 bills. For each one destroyed, replace it by releasing one from the reserve of bazillions of $1.00 coins we taxpayers are paying rent to store.
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n9jig's Avatar
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997 Posts
 Posted 03/10/2012  10:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add n9jig to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
DM1975
Huh? Half dollars haven't been made for circulation in years, just mint and proof sets have them. National Parks quarters have not been put into circulation in the way the State Quarters were so they are scarce in circulation, not that they haven't caught the imagination of anyone, in fact most people that I know who collect prefer their designs to the State Quarters.


That is pretty much what I said...


Quote:
DM1975
And why the hole in the cent? And why no dime? What is the reasoning behind these changes?


The hole allows the blind to decipher the coin from the slightly larger 5 cent piece. I thought it might be easier to make than flattened edges like some Canadian coins had.

The dime is not as usable as the 5 cent piece currently except that it is smaller. With this system the dime would not really be needed since the new 5 cent piece would be small, 2 new 5 cent pieces allow more flexibility than a single 10 cent piece.



Quote:
DM1975
Wouldn't it be easier to just change completion instead of forcing people to learn a whole new coinage system?


I imagine you meant to say change composition. (I hate spell check sometimes!).

Yes, it would be easier, but this is my nonsensical rant and I like it! But, like The NickelGuy said, whatever they end up doing it will cost more to make a cent, even if they get the material for free. That is why I like the devaluation option better.

What I think is going to happen eventually is that the cent will be abolished (except for proof and mint sets) and the nickel debased to some cheaper metal.

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ghostrider's Avatar
United States
1116 Posts
 Posted 03/10/2012  12:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ghostrider to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just try try to get change for a $500 bill at the local bank. I did that once from grins and the teller thought it was counterfeit and called for a manager who was going to sieze the bill. I brought it out just to show her because she had never seen an Ike dollar. After the reception I got I'm not going to bring in either a Half Cent or a Three Cent piece let alone a $.20 and try to get some pennies for it.

However, sometimes I do feel that our money is more and more taking on the look of monopoly money. When the dollar coin was more in use the cost of living was much lower than now and the dollar meant something.

I feel that to do away with some of the coins will just add (although slightly) to the cost of living. Instead something costing $.02 will now be $.05. I feel that coins were supposed to be a way of helping commerce.

Making coins to help the blind is a noble idea, but how are there going to tell the difference between $1, $5, and $10. Perhaps the treasury should make difference size notes.

Every idea proposed for currency is going to have unintended consequences. As much as I would hate to see it come, but really why would the mint cater its coinage to just a small group of citizens. Further, why not just do away with the half dollar and dollar coins entirely if they are not going to be circulated.

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SteveCaruso's Avatar
United States
1796 Posts
 Posted 03/10/2012  2:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SteveCaruso to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The Half Cent coin was phased out (for the reason that it was "worth too little") when it had the relative purchasing power of 11 modern cents.

Dollar notes, pennies, and (as much as I love them) nickels should have their days numbered.
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Ridge_Runner's Avatar
United States
70 Posts
 Posted 03/10/2012  3:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ridge_Runner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think you're idea about changing the reverse every five years (and following a theme) is a pretty good one. While I do like the state and ATB Quarters, and understand why we release so many per year, I wouldn't mind seeing them scale back the number of designs they release per year. I think the reason the ATB Quarters aren't as popular is because the mint has released 71 different quarter designs in the past 14 years (that includes all five designs from this year). They've became common place now. Every kid up to the age of 14 is used to seeing a new quarter come out every 2½ months. I still enjoy it, but I would say it has entered the mundane realm for most Americans. They need to take a break for a few years after the ATBs and let the public start to crave something different again.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
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 Posted 03/10/2012  3:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I too like the idea of making our coins with a hole in the center. Or holes all the way around the just inside edge. Now that would save all that metal that everyone is complaining about.
Also, have all our coin mintages outsourced to China. Why not, they are already making lots of ours and many now in slabs they invent too.
Allowing China to make our coins would mean a massive reduction in Mint workers, Mint metal suppliers, all associated with the Mint here to have to get a job at McDonalds, or equal and pay into Social Security like the rest of us. Additionally so many politicians are now wasting time with debates as to our coins so they too would then be out of a job. More savings for us all.
Allowing China to make our coins would also make our metal costs go down since we will not need so much. And why bother counterfeiting since they make the real stuff anyway.
Then too there could be a open bidding on out coinage production for the entire World. This too could help reduce the cost of making our coins with others forcing the bidding to go to the lowest bidder.
AND if there are any complaints from the vending machine people, we'll just outsource that product to China too.
Now I wonder if I forwarded this post to China, I'd get a kickback if accepted.
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
188130 Posts
 Posted 03/12/2012  3:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think you are over-thinking it.

Kill the cent and five cent coins.

Kill the one dollar note; replace with the one dollar coin.

People who do not understand (or trust) how rounding works or cannot figure out how to not have a pocket full of dollar coins can just use their electronic cards.

Problem solved.
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wquinn's Avatar
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2295 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  10:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wquinn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

But also kill the half dollar too.

I do like the idea better to change the value of our money to one tenth of what it is, since no changes to our coins or what is being minted and still make them affordable to mint.
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cc99999's Avatar
United States
1302 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  12:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cc99999 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You guys have it all wrong. If this congress changes our coinage they'd:

Create a 40 cent coin and put Reagan on it. Create a 99 cent coin and put Herman Cain on it. Make a scratch and sniff dollar bill which costs $5 to print and then recast the cent in some sort of cracker material that dissolves in the rain. I'd rather not entrust this congress with making any more changes to our monetary system.

;)
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5850 Posts
 Posted 03/13/2012  1:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Gee -- if they kill off the cent and the nickel, those .99 and 9/10th prices at the gas pump will really be ridiculous, huh?

Just wanted to echo what DM1975 said about the National Parks quarters. I absolutely love them but simply haven't seen any in circulation. I don't know if they're being hoarded by people who buy boxes of them and store them away (or sell them on ebay) or whether fewer are being minted, but I don't think it's a matter of them "not capturing the imagination of the public" (which implies that people see them and don't care about them).

As for the rest of the suggestions, just think about the millions of vending machines that are out there that would need to be completely retooled to accept new sizes! Please, won't somebody think of the children vending machines?
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wquinn's Avatar
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 Posted 03/13/2012  1:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wquinn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Gee -- if they kill off the cent and the nickel, those .99 and 9/10th prices at the gas pump will really be ridiculous, huh?

That is a good question, but I don't think those types of prices would change, since people generally don't buy just one item like that. And it would be on the final price if any rounding for cash purchases needed to be made.

Those kinds of prices are a mental sales thing and not for any practical sales or coin availability purpose. The same principle would apply to list things at those prices with or without the cent. Things are supposed to sound cheaper if it cost 99 cents as opposed to a dollar. Or $9.99 instead of $10. It doesn't work for me.
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 03/13/2012  2:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
But also kill the half dollar too.
It is already dead, for circulation anyway. It is NIFC; the same status I would like for the cent and nickel.

Quote:
Gee -- if they kill off the cent and the nickel, those .99 and 9/10th prices at the gas pump will really be ridiculous, huh?
Oh really? Then I suppose the 9/10th of a cent pricing at the gas pump is already ridiculous, since we do not have a 1/10th cent coin!
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 03/13/2012  2:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Those kinds of prices are a mental sales thing and not for any practical sales or coin availability purpose. The same principle would apply to list things at those prices with or without the cent. Things are supposed to sound cheaper if it cost 99 cents as opposed to a dollar. Or $9.99 instead of $10.
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barryg's Avatar
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 Posted 03/13/2012  3:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Oh really? Then I suppose the 9/10th of a cent pricing at the gas pump is already ridiculous, since we do not have a 1/10th cent coin!


Yes. By "really ridiculous" I meant "even more ridiculous than it is right now." Fractions of a cent won't make any sense (no pun intended) whatsoever when there's no longer such thing as a "cent" in the first place...
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