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American Eagle Bullion

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Author Previous TopicReplies: 11 / Views: 1,962Next Topic  
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ccw2805's Avatar
United States
78 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2012  5:58 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add ccw2805 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I have a small collection of American Eagle silver dollars and am curious about grading. I know how to grade them but at what grade do the coins just become worth face value? For example I see that MS-70 and MS-69 graded silver dollars can carry a collector value but I don't see much after that.
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unholyroller's Avatar
United States
1903 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2012  6:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add unholyroller to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To me bullion is bullion. There may be some that will pay a premium for non-key dates in 70, but I would NEVER pay to have one graded, 70 or not.
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United States
259 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2012  6:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chasinva69 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Quote:
I have a small collection of American Eagle silver dollars and am curious about grading. I know how to grade them but at what grade do the coins just become worth face value? For example I see that MS-70 and MS-69 graded silver dollars can carry a collector value but I don't see much after that.


face value? I assume you mean spot value (of silver). Big difference.


Quote:
To me bullion is bullion. There may be some that will pay a premium for non-key dates in 70, but I would NEVER pay to have one graded, 70 or not


+1.
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ccw2805's Avatar
United States
78 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2012  7:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ccw2805 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I meant spot value sorry.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5855 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2012  7:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm guessing it might be more relevant with proof ASEs, since those tend to be more collectible than bullion and cost a lot more to begin with.
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DM1975's Avatar
United States
284 Posts
 Posted 03/15/2012  11:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DM1975 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think graded ASE's are rediculous. Proofs ok I guess, but the whole purpose of the coins are for bullion. I have owned a bunch of em in the past and have eventually flipped em all at some point for gold when I have seen the market taking a fall so now I only have one left and I don't miss em at all. I do however love all the gold coins I have gotten with them in dips.

ETA: I will buy more eventually, but just for bullion.
Edited by DM1975
03/16/2012 12:17 am
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clairhardesty's Avatar
United States
1027 Posts
 Posted 03/16/2012  08:58 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add clairhardesty to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are three main types of ASEs, bullion (which the mint sells to APs for $2.00 over spot in boxes of 500), uncirculated, and proof (including reverse proof) both of which are struck on specially prepared planchets using specially prepared die and individually handled and packaged and sold directly to the public. The last two are not bullion products, they are numismatic versions of the bullion product but they are not intended to be PM investment vehicles. Typically with modern SAEs, the only coins that increase in value over initial mint prices when graded are those that achieve a 70 (MS or PR). The fact that some people like to collect the bullion coins just as they do the numismatic versions is perfectly understandable. It is no different than collecting high quality circulating coins in addition to the annual mint offerings of special strike coins. MS70 graded bullion coins can be of significant value to collectors but that value has decreased for the more recent years because even though MS70 is a fairly rare grade on a percentage basis for bullion, the sheer numbers of coins produced in recent years means that plenty of those examples are available. The average quality of the bullion strikes has also improved over the years, adding to the number of high quality examples on the market. Early year MS70 specimens are still of decent value because of their relative rarity. For almost all SAE products a grade of 69 or below is worth the initial mint price, whether that be the $2.00 over spot the APs give for bullion coins, or whatever the mint is currently charging for uncirculated or proof products. That means that grading is an expense that cannot be recovered unless a grade of 70 is assigned.
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ccw2805's Avatar
United States
78 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2012  8:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ccw2805 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the replies, I don't necessarily collect circulated bullion coins. I only get proof and uncirculated ASE's. If MS-70's are the only ones worth collecting then why are there so many MS-69's graded and circulating on ebay? Are they just the ones that didn't make the MS-70 when they were sent in for grading and not purposely sent to be graded as MS-69?
Edited by ccw2805
03/17/2012 8:21 pm
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trout1105's Avatar
Australia
7096 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2012  8:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add trout1105 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I can't see why you would bother to get these slabbed at about $30 extra per bullion round. You are virtually doubling the cost of your silver investment, which is what these coins are. Simply Silver bullion and not intended to be a coin for circulation.
It may be a way to "Value add" if you want to sell it on ebay but other than that I feel that it is just a waste of money
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unholyroller's Avatar
United States
1903 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2012  8:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add unholyroller to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You are correct...as stated earlier....people send ASEs in for grading hoping for a 70 grade. When they get them back and the don't grade out at a 70 they then turn them loose hoping to recover as much of the grading cost as possible with the knowledge that unless some uneducated person snaps it up at a premium, they will likely be out the cost of having it graded. For dealers that do this on a regular basis I am sure some vaguely reliable percentage of the coins they send in do get a 70 grade. What I don't understand is the in all likelyhood, the premium they can derive from a 70 graded coin is offset by all the 69s they had to absorb the grading cost on. Unless you are a talented and experienced person who can spot a 70 grade coin with great reliability it would seem to be a financial effort of futility.
Edited by unholyroller
03/17/2012 8:42 pm
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biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2012  9:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
It may be a way to "Value add" if you want to sell it on ebay but other than that I feel that it is just a waste of money

Not much point in spending $300 to add $5 to the retail value. Sorta like putting $75 gas in the tank of a car so it weighs $10 more at the scrapyard.

Most people don't realize that modern coins in quantities of 100+ of the same coin get special rates, like $3 per. So even if you pay $400 for 20 coins and get two ms70 ($200 per), you can't compete with the guy paying $300 for 100 and getting ten ms70 ($30 per).
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ibab's Avatar
United States
167 Posts
 Posted 03/20/2012  6:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ibab to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you want them slabbed - you are better off buying them slabbed. They can be bought in the grade you want for less than you can get it graded -- normally. If you check the pops the percentages of them coming back MS 70 is only like 7% -- the rest 93% are ms 69. This is from guys who are submitting them at least 500 at a time (a box). I can't tell you the prices that you can get when you get this many graded, but PCGS does one price for a 69 (low) and another for each 70 (higher).

When I averaged the two together for some proofs I was going to send in based on my expected grade - it still was going to be closer to $10 a coin. Or the bulk price for 100+ coins no more than 5 mint mark/years.

At one point in time I thought I could win the grading game - with only like 30 or so, no... to win you need to be doing submissions of 1000's. Sure I'll get the ones that I keep for less than market value and I'll make a few dollars on the 70's and lose a few dollars on the 69s.

If you have some of the W mint eagles - burnished - those can carry a premium in 70 - but check the years first - some years are very common.
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