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Another Greek

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Pillar of the Community

United States
1315 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  4:27 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Doucet to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Sicly, Syracuse AE17, 6.3 grams

ΣΥΡÎ'[CΩ]? Head of Athena left in Corinthian helmet decorated with / Hippocamp left.

Sear dates these to the time of Timoleon ca 344-336 BC, but it now appears that they were probably struck during the time of Dionysios I (405-367 BC), most likely ca 390 BC. (Coinproject)

This example is a bit different than others in that the Helmet is decorated with another object (not sure what... serpent?) rather than the usual laurel wreath and the inscription is longer than the usual ΣYPA
Another--Greek
Bedrock of the Community
DVCollector's Avatar
United States
10045 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  4:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice, interesting Litra--I really like the details on the Hippocampus!
I'm unsure of the symbol on Athena's helmet--maybe somebody will recognize it.
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echizento's Avatar
United States
23731 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  6:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice, excellent reverse detail.
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  6:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The fabric of these litra coins intrigue me.
They have a slight point at either end of a diameter.
I have not read how the blanks may have been made, but by the looks of them, the metal may have been pressed in a mold, with the bronze in the paste range.

The 'Paste Range' temperature of an alloy is where one of the metals which make up the alloy is liquid, but where other metals in the alloy are still solid.
With bronze in this instance, tin has a melting point of 232 deg. C., and copper has a melting point of 1083 deg. C. The pouring temperature for bronze is around 1110 deg.C. As can be seen the paste temerature range is quite large of around 850 C. degrees, which makes bronze an alloy easy to work with.


I have presented a few facts about bronze as an alloy here, but I have not read anything about how this information may have been applied to the making of blanks for the bronze litra coins of Syracuse. I stand to learn if my assumption made above is near the mark or not.
Pillar of the Community
United States
1315 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  7:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Doucet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That's interesting thinking Sel. I do not know the answer.

I had never thought about the fabric of these flans until now.

I may be able to find something out, or hopefully someone here will know.

Thanks
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DVCollector's Avatar
United States
10045 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  7:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sel_691,
That's interesting reading about the "paste range" of bronze. I have seen this flan shape on other AEs from Syracuse, and also wondered if those corners were remnants of casting sprues, mentioned here.
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  7:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My assumption is that the blanks were cast by pressing into a mould, and the coins were struck s from the blanks. My assumption. I stand to be corrected and thus learn.
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TJsCoins's Avatar
United States
3229 Posts
 Posted 03/25/2012  8:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TJsCoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A knowledgeable ancient coin dealer agrees with you Sel.

He had one that looked very similar to this:http://wildwinds.com/coins/greece/s...iati_042.jpg

BTW. Awesome coin Doucet!

I gotta get some Mythical Creatures!
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