Spanish/Bolivian 8 Reales 1791 Carolus IIIi

I would say that position of the letters is NOT what is most suspect about the coin. To me it is the edge design. It is interesting to see an almost exact match however. Where is that coin being sold and does the seller know Spanish American? It could be that we are dealing with two counterfeit varieties from the same source as well.

The Potosi coins were not up to Mexican standards (and at the time were noted for at times being low in silver percentage) - but the edge is too crude to be believed in my opinion. I will of course know more when I see the coin in person.

Regarding the die clash - it is possible that the die involved was clashed. I have not seen this exact type of clash in the past and I look forward to examining it up close.

realeswatcher I have bought several coins from Xavier which he believed were real and which I have classified as Counterfeit. The primary difference of opinion is over the existence of the Bullion Class of forgeries.

Coincidentally, I am writing this as I am taking a break from reviewing the section on the Bullion Counterfeits for our book on Portrait counterfeits.

Many dealers believe INCORRECTLY that if an 8R is made of 903 fine silver and is of the correct weight it HAS TO BE REAL. They see no profit in this arrangement.

Their error is in the assumption that there was no profit to be made in making a full weight silver forgery in the period from 1830 to 1930.

But if they knew their history they would know that Carolus Dollars carried a premium of 12-50% over intrinsic value when used to purchase goods in Mainland China. The cost to make and transport the "replica" coins to China in 1880 amounted to under 8% of the intrinsic value. This left a significant profit for the merchants involved.

There is a second incentive that can be gleaned from history as well. In about 1873, world silver prices began to fall, such that most dollar coins became Tokens. Their silver content was far below $1. In that time frame there was an additional incentive provided you could get the coins taken at a FACE value of $1.

So we may have a real silver coin BUT one made after 1830 in one or BOTH cases.