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 Replies: 28 / Views: 1,991 |
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Valued Member
United States
382 Posts |
So I go away for a couple of weeks and I come back and read the following in Coin World: "The US Mint's plan to depict a theme of 'liberty, freedom and independence' on a new series of 24 kt. gold bullion coins ran into a buzz saw of criticism during the Citizens Coinage Advisory Committee (CCAC) May 24th meeting in Washington. Several members (Ute Wartenberg, Connie Harriman and Rita Laws) of the panel attacked the plan as "much more political" than the .9999 fine, 24 kt. coins of other nations and pleaded with mint officials to consider other themes for the coins." Apparently, 30-year mint bullion official John Warriner was shot down when he had the nerve to suggest to the CCAC that liberty, or something that "represents the soul of the county" would be ideal for this new coin. I guess some of the members like Panda's, Maple leaves, beavers, turtles, bisons, or whatever over Lady Liberty or some symbol of her. I never thought I would live to see the day when Lady Liberty would be deemed as "too political" for a bullion coin that will be seen all over the world. The CCAC plans to meet at the ANA meeting on Thursday afternoon on July 28th. I wish I could be there to give them a piece of my mind...but do you think they will listen to us?  |
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Valued Member
United States
421 Posts |
I read that article too and my mouth dropped open when I did. I thought it rather sad.
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Pillar Of The Community
3147 Posts |
I have already had a letter to the editor printed in Coin World this past week. I supported the CCAC on this issue and prefer something like a gold buffalo for our new coin. Like it or not, the Mint wants U.S. investors and collectors to purchase these coins as well as collectors and investors all over the WORLD. We must choose a theme that people all over this planet would not be offended to own. This is a money making project for the Mint and our government, nothing more and nothing less. My wife and I both collect bullion from China, Canada, Australia and a little from S. Africa. There designs are simple and non-political and that is what it takes to get me to purchase them. I don't want another country shoving their culture, beliefs or politics down my throat and I am sure many places in the world don't want use doing the same. While I would like very much to see Lady Liberty, Lady Peace, Lady Freedom or anything else the Mint engravers can come up with on our circulating coinage I whole heartedly understand this issue and how we may be perceived by other nations. I am not saying I like those perceptions, whether they be right or wrong, but I am saying for this program to be successful all over the world the design MUST be simple, non-political and non-religious and nothing would please me more than to offer the world the American Bison! Of course the Eagle will grace the reverse so I see a perfect coin in the design. |
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Valued Member
 United States
382 Posts |
So that was your letter: "No Politics"...I never knew!?!
Anyways, I have to respectfully disagree. [Even though I am a huge fan of the bison...look left!]
Lady Liberty is not political. It represents beliefs and desires of ALL people. It is the inherit nature for all people to desire freedom and liberty. I can't imagine a person ever honestly admitting they don't desire freedom or liberty!?!
When many of my ancestors arrived in the late 19th Century, many wrote in their journals how they felt when they first saw the Statue of Liberty. They looked at "her" as freedom, opportunity, liberty, hope, and a new life all packaged into one. One wrote that other than the birth of his children and getting married to my great-great grandmother, it was the happiest day in his life!
You are right...when people see a leaf they think of Canada. They think of China when they see a Panda...and I would bet a month's salary that most in the world when they see Liberty, they think of America!
Edited by zakgold
06/16/2005 10:24 pm
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Pillar Of The Community
3147 Posts |
Yes, Zakgold, most would think of Liberty but.....what about those who would think other wise. To some, Liberty stirs hate as it is associated with our politics? Like it or not there are many in the world who want the same things we do but see very different ways of getting there. And, quite frankly, it is very hard for most Americans to understand that everyone does not think the same way we do. Don't get me wrong on this issue, as I am all for Lady Liberty but, as I have said, this is a money making venture for the Mint and the government and there are those masses out there just waiting to say, "Look at this" regardless of what the U.S. meant! I know, in ways we will always be fighting a losing battle as there are those filled with hatred that will never subside but to truely ever come close to world peace everyone, in every nation, must give and take and I, for one, would rather share our classic the American Bison with the world and hope the program finds great success and people all over the world learn to love the American Buffalo just as much as we do.
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Rest in Peace
United States
2884 Posts |
The American Bison, as being symbolic to America has always been to me somewhat ironic. We as an expanding and conquering nation did all we could to exterminate this animal and the life it provided for the indigenous peoples of this continent. Out of the moral guilt, many Americans ultimately felt bad for what we had done to the American Indian and their culture and went through a period of honoring the fallen nations with symbolic coinage as well as adopting and maintaining a great number of Native American names for the very land we had stolen by breaking treaty after treaty.  I think it was and is honorable for Americans to recognize their errors, as hindsight is certainly clearer than foresight. I for one feel that a nations coinage does in fact show something of their character and feel Lady Liberty, love her or hate her is one of ours. I find no shame in this what so ever and feel we as a Nation have done more good than harm in the world. We are not perfect, and as illustrated by our coinage, we show that we can be and are humbled by our past mistakes. Thanks, Peace to the World, Mike  |
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Forum Mom
 United States
5877 Posts |
Since, as I understand it (and correct me if I'm wrong), the other design being considered for the bullion coin is the "first lady" series, how can they think that Lady Liberty is more political than that?[:0]
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Pillar Of The Community
3147 Posts |
Nope Susan, you must be corrected on this one. The First Spouse coins may be the first commemorative gold to be 24K but they are not the new bullion coin coming next year. Basically the gold eagle, as we know now, is only 22K gold so they have decided that to go to 24K they must have a new design to avoid confusion (good idea) as most folks down the road won't remember what year they made the switch to 24k from 22k without a design change. The first ladies have nothing to do with this new 24K bullion other than the fact someone in Congress has decided they may sell better if they were 24K as well. Personally I think that series will be one of the biggest flops in mint history and it is doomed before it even starts. Way to pricey for the average collector and no one really knows or cares about the first ladies. Only a few stand out for one reason or another and the rest were......(You fill in the blank here) whatever each of us see them as! NOT WORTHY of GOLD.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
Many countries throughout the world have seen Lady liberty coming and stand today as free nations due to our belief in Freedom and liberty !!
Personally I dont give a (insert expleative here ) about the world market ,or the touchy feely sense of lets try not to ruffle the feathers of our communistic, corrupt,religous, political enemies around the world,if we cant stand up!! then we need to sit down and shut up !!
You've got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything !!! an appropo line .
some folks miss the fact that anything this government produces does not belong to the government but to the people which it represents,Including our coins .
Want to put a symbol on a coin that can be respected throughout the world ? How about an Eagle obverse and a dont tread on me ledgend on the reverse with crossed sabres as a center piece ?
Rick
Edited by Metalman
06/17/2005 11:26 am
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Forum Mom
United States
5877 Posts |
Thanks for the clarification, Terry. I stand happily corrected. I have to say though that I don't think it's necessary for our coinage to be considered to be "politically correct" for other nations, however. This is OUR coinage. It should have meaning for US. If collectors elsewhere want to collect it also, that's great, but to design our coinage based on what people in other countries want is absurd!  |
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Valued Member
United States
382 Posts |
The 22kt American Gold coins does contain one ounce of gold. It weighs 33.931 grams which is more than a troy ounce. We are not cheating the world, we just added some copper and silver to the coin to give it more strength than pure gold. Many people believe it doesn't contain a full ounce of gold when it fact it does. I have to agree with Metalman that I too, don't give a rat's behind what the world thinks about us. If they already hate us, putting an American Bison on a pure gold coin is not going to make them feel better about us. Instead of bending over for the world, we need to act like the world's leader. America needs to lead...not follow. If that means that we are proud of a symbol that demonstrates everything what America is all about, so be it. We have NOTHING to apologize about the symbol of Lady Liberty, our flag, or our country. As my mother use to say, "Never offer any explanation...your friends don't need one and your enemies will never believe it anyway." This country was founded on the ideas of life, liberty, freedom, and opportunity. Instead of apologizing for these political themes as some people believe like the CCAC, we need to trumpet them. Now where is that highest mountain so I can shout, "God Bless America!"?  Edited by zakgold
06/17/2005 11:55 am
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Pillar Of The Community
3147 Posts |
Well guys and gals, let me try to put this in another way! The U.S. has been the most demanded, most hoarded, most sought after and most respected currency and coin in the world. But, lo and behold that has changed somewhat in the last 3 years and it is very very important to you and I that we make every effort to shore up the U.S. dollar and put it back in #1 where it belongs. Like it or not we are in a global economy and having the world wanting our money and coins for whatever reason is good for our economy and our stature world wide, regardless or our politics, our religions, or our freedoms. We need the world and they need us as we are all in one big spider web now! It would be very easy to say I don't give a rats behind, and at times I don't but on this issue I DO! Now for what it is worth legislation has been introduced to start the new bullion program off (first year) with gold reproductions of the Buffalo nickel. That is fresh from this weeks Coin World that arrived yesterday. After the first year the design could be changed to what ever the Treasurer and Mint, under the guidance of the CCAC, deemed appropriate. I think this legislation is an effort to put out "something" in 2006 and this would be the quickest way to get artwork and dies ready by the end of the year. Quite simply it would give the Mint another year to get new designs ready and approved. Looks like we may finally get our gold buffalo after all? |
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Valued Member
United States
256 Posts |
Does this mean we have to remove all the mottos also?
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Valued Member
United States
382 Posts |
Just wait...the day will come to seeing "In Allah We Trust" on U.S. coins. After all, we have to make everybody happy (as they spit on us behind on backs). Quick...grab a hand and sing, "In Perfect Harmony". (The old Coke commerical)
Believe me, our enemies hate us just as much after 9/11 than before it. Trying to appease them with PC coins is not going to make one "dime of difference". This is the time NOT to back down, but to stand up for what is right!
Remember, evil wins when good does nothing.
Edited by zakgold
06/17/2005 2:07 pm
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Pillar Of The Community
3147 Posts |
Zakgold I understand every word that you have said and agree with 99% of it! I just WANT that darn golden buffalo! There will be no Allah We Trust on my money! That would bring out something ELSE I collect!
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
1091 Posts |
My Two Cents worth. I'd be happy with a golden bufflo. I'd be more happy with Liberty on all US coins. (Instead of dead presidents) What raises the hair on the back of my neck is how "Libery, Freedom and Independence" could run into "a buzzsaw of criticism", and how they could be politicial. I did not see the designs or read the article but... It's how they are depicted that may have brought up the objection. Perhaps they showed... Liberty as American flag on top of Sadams statue,... Freedom as Gitmo prison camp, and... Independence as Arafat & Sharon shaking hands. I did not see the designs and perhaps the group thought a bufflo would be a non-political USA symbol. The French (before the Euro) had Liberty on most of their coins, as well as many others countries portray Lady Liberty on theirs also. Edited by toast
06/17/2005 9:57 pm
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Replies: 28 / Views: 1,991 |
Posted 06/16/2005 9:42 pm
