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 Replies: 23 / Views: 3,281 |
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New Member
United States
11 Posts |
Hi, I'm new here and in general am interested in having fun while collecting coins & in learning about numismatics. But I have a really odd e-bay situation and need some advice on how to resolve it. Recently I purchased several raw uncirculated Franklin half dollars that I received yesterday in the mail. These coins went via USPS and took a long time to arrive (no big deal) - except as soon I open my email at home there is a request from the seller to return one of the coins to him so that he can issue me a full refund.  Note that I didn't ask for nor do I want a refund. In fact I was generally very pleased with the quality of the coins. I also realized that he must have been sitting on top of the tracking notice as the email came ASAP after the post office had time to record that the package had been signed for. As far as I know all bidding and payment went smoothly and neither of us has any complaint against the other. He and I both have 100% feedback, and since he was selling so many Franklins I checked his recent purchases and found that he had been buying rolls of decent/good looking Franklins of the same dates he was selling for reasonable (not cheap) prices. I assumed he was cherry picking the best for keeps or slabbing and e-baying the rest as good solid coins. I then queried him as to why he wanted the coin back stating that I was pleased with the purchase. He stated that he had taken coins from the wrong roll and his partner was very upset with him as the roll had been sold to someone else and he would happily issue a full refund including shipping. The coin in question is a 1954-S in either MS 64-65, a very clean (but not cleaned) coin but showing a really weak strike and no wear. It is a very attractive coin, not blast white but with great eye appeal. I do not feel that it would be considered an FBL (nor was it sold as such) but I am not a grader - it might be 3/4 but the strike is very weak. On the market this coin could be worth anything from $12 (MS-64 no FBL) to $200 (MS-65 FBL) - these are from realized Heritage auctions. I paid $25 because (1)I really felt that it would probably be an MS-65 (and I am not planning on slabbing it - never was), (2) it has great eye appeal and (3) would be a nice start to a Franklin collection. However while looking for realized prices at Heritage, I noticed about 10 BIN 1954-S FBL Franklins graded by PCGS that look as though they could be the sisters and brothers (or at least cousins) of mine all priced at $245-250. And I am now wondering if it is the same seller as the guys who were selling on E-bay and if they want the coin back to see if he can get a better price? I still believe though that mine would not grade an FBL/FL and therefore is worth a maximum of $50, and maybe that in a couple of years. And I believe that I honored the terms and conditions of their sale. My plan is to start a collection (not to buy for resale) and I really like the coin. I don't know these guys and I probably don't have a charitable view of their motives. What do you guys think? Thanks in advance and sorry for the long post. Moved to ebay discussions by Metalman |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
Hi Sirene
from the story you told ,,your under no obligation to return the coin based on the reason given .
If you want to help the guy out and continue to buy franklins from him you could ,, but you don't have to in my opinion.
I am curious though ,,Is the coin you received the one pictured in the auction ?
Welcome to the forum !
Metalman
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New Member
 United States
11 Posts |
Well the auction stated it was for a 1954-S, and by numbers and appearances I got the coin pictured. I really don't remember if it was a BIN or of I sniped it. I would consider returning the coin (although I do not want to) if I felt it was an honest mistake. But I don't really want to return the coin to someone who just wants a better price and I guess the problem is that I don't know how to tell the difference.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
My opinion is its your coin you bought it ,, If you want to keep it keep it .
There is no way to know anything more about the sellers motive than what He has told you ,,except what your gut is telling you about it .
Metalman
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New Member
United States
11 Posts |
My gut tells me several things, (1) this guy is really worried so somewhere along the way someone did make a mistake or did something that they were not supposed to do, (2) this coin is a ringer for the ones on the Heritage site - probably coming from the roll they bought a week prior to my purchase, and might have a possibility of making an FL 65 slab (though I doubt it) and (3) after I return it I will see it up for sale for more $. I am not sure that these guys always sell Franklins or that I will buy more from them in the future anyway. I scoured ebay last night looking for help topics addressing this issue but it is usually the buyer that wants to reutrn the item, not the seller wanting it back. Thanks for your help Metalman. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1173 Posts |
This is tough because I suspect it is really hard to know if this is the coin that was pictured in the sale. If you are reasonably certain that the coin you now have is the same one that was pictured in the sale, then I don't believe you have any obligation to return it. If, on the other hand, you deep down think it's different from the one pictured, then you should return the coin. (Let's take a more extreme example: let's say you bid on a 1916-S Mercury dime, but were sent a 1916-D dime in the same grade. You'd know then, for sure, that a mistake had been made, and that the seller was reasonable is asking for the coin's return, and you, perhaps, would be legally obligated to return the coin. This would be based on the same principle that when a bank incorrectly deposits money in your account, you can't keep it, and, in fact, are obligated to tell the bank if you find the error before they do.) Good luck. Do what you feel is right...so you can sleep at night. If keeping the coin will bother you, send it back. If sending it back will make you feel as though you were cheated, then keep it. Only you can determine what is right. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
The seller according to the story did not offer to send another coin only return the funds for the coin which was sold/sent ,,If the wrong coin had been sold/sent then it seems to me that the offer would have been to send the right coin for the return of the wrong one .
Metalman
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New Member
United States
11 Posts |
The content of the e-mail that I received led me to believe that he was not supposed to sell those particular coins (the 1954-s and some others) not that he grabbed the wrong ones per say. But he advertised, sold and sent an 1954-s that looked like the one in the picture.
IMO they sent several 1954-S's in to get slabbed and they came back as FL/FBL MS-65's instead of just MS-65's (a $200 price difference) and scrambled to retrieve the two listed on E-Bay. Or they expected a bidding war for the item that never happened. Dunno. As you get older you get more cynical and are less inclined to clean up other peoples messes.
I will probably sell the coin back at cost via a paypal invoice just to terminate the situation and avoid anymore hassles. Overall these guys don't seem bad but as a buyer it is not worth my time or money to deal with a situation like this.
I have sold and bought a variety of things on e-bay and if you ask me someone has to be standing on a seller pretty hard to get them to ask for their item back. As a seller I burned myself pretty good once or twice in the beginning but I would never have asked for the item back from the buyer - against a sale that was legally binding. You just learn from those lessons and don't do things you shouldn't do.
Thanks for all of the advice, I have been lurking here for a bit & really value all of the knowledge you guys have.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
819 Posts |
As a seller I too have been burned on ebay by mistakes on my part, but I never ask to cancel the deal or refund for return of the item. I think the seller is demonstrating poor form by doing so in this case, grit your teeth and learn from your mistakes. From your standpoint I would be in a 50/50 quandry as to which direction to go; given that you think the sellers are "nice guys", etc I might return it, but any hint of larceny or such I would keep it. Saying that, if you are convinced they (if there is a "they") only want to get it back to ONLY to make more money on it...keep it IMHO. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1984 Posts |
You bid, you bought, you got.
End of story.
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New Member
United States
11 Posts |
From the standpoint of just being a casual collector I think I will return the coin. Frankly I was happier before I had it and I think I will be happier after I get rid of it. My interest in coins is more casual - basically I enjoy the history and artistry. Plus I won't be involved in something that I don't understand. Viva la pocket change! Maybe a roll or two of nickels from the bank?
Thanks again to all of you. Hope to post on another topic soon.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1173 Posts |
The seller according to the story did not offer to send another coin only return the funds for the coin which was sold/sent ,,If the wrong coin had been sold/sent then it seems to me that the offer would have been to send the right coin for the return of the wrong one .
Metalman
Good point, Metalman. I'm leaning more and more toward saying "keep the coin." If they somehow managed to sell the same coin to two different buyers, you can bet that they are asking for it back only because the other buyer is paying more for it (or it is part of a bigger deal that might otherwise get cancelled.)
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1984 Posts |
I would not return the coin. Let's say the seller turns around and sells it for more than even he thinks it's really worth. Is he going to tell the buyer that the buyer paid too much for it and here's some money back? I don't think so. There's something wrong here and I think you should report the seller to ebay before agreeing to do anything with your (and it is yours) coin. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
597 Posts |
In the end it is not what others would do here, but only your emotion and settlement that makes you happy that is the primary focus of what you should perform in this instance. If it was an FBL 1954-S Franklin in suspected MS-65 I would send it back myself. But if it was a 1944-S Walker in MS-65, I would say "Fat Chance" come and pry it!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
603 Posts |
I am curious, how long of an auction was it? If it was an example of selling the wrong coin they should have caught it themselves, or contacted you right away, not waiting until after they saw you had signed for it. I would keep the coin, if it is the one pictured, a seller should be responsible for their own auctions. For example, My only e-bay sale was an unopened vhs set of the origional star wars trilogy. I put no reserve on it and guesstimated shipping costs. I got one bid for $.01 and under charged for shipping by over 2 bucks, I was obligated to complete the sale. My point is, they listed the coin and you bought it, as long as it is the coin pictured, they are showing a lot of chutzpa asking for it back. Keep it and enjoy it.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2254 Posts |
Can we see pictures of the coin and pictures of the auction? As for the dilemma, I would suggest telling the seller to send you 4 more mint state halves in different dates. Once you receive them, you will return the 54s.  Bottom line, do what you feel is best, and what will not give you a pit in your stomach. It seems this is bothering you, and while I think this is sellers remorse in that they didn't make enough money, if you return it, you can always monitor it for being re-listed and then complain/report. Pictures of the coin received would be great though... |
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Replies: 23 / Views: 3,281 |
Posted 08/15/2007 12:06 pm
