Shill Bidding Example?

Wow, that's egregious. I'd report it to ebay if I thought there was a remote chance they'd try to stop it.

I reported it. It's OBVIOUSLY shill bidding. I bet the people who do this stuff don't even consider themselves exactly what they are. Crooks.

*** Edited by Dad for family friendliness. ***

chrsb,

That is amazing! I thought I knew a lot about ebay tools, but not this one. Can you give a quick tutorial on how you were able to get the bid history. Thanks.

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Well, no it's not obvious. You have zero proof.

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Bobby, could you provide a reasonable, plausible explanation for why that one user has 7 pages of bids ONLY to vette1986's auctions... many of which it won AND has zero feedback?

I'll try one: vette1986 has a physical store where these coins are offered at a certain price before being sold on ebay. catfood978928 is a customer at the store who also knows that vette lists on ebay. Instead of purchasing coins for list prices at the shop, catfood decides to take his chances by bidding online and only bids to prices below those he would otherwise get in the shop. Then he doesn't pay for shipping but picks up the items at the store. He and vette have agreed not to exchange feedback because it's too much of a bother--catfood978928 has no interest in purchasing from anyone else so feedback is unimportant, and vette has thousands of listings and is glad for the break from providing feedback.

As plausible as I can come up with.

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Bobby, could you provide a reasonable, plausible explanation for why that one user has 7 pages of bids ONLY to vette1986's auctions... many of which it won AND has zero feedback?

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Sure, they guy is vettes neighbor and only buys from him. There is no feedback left because he doesn't want to daw attention to the purchases for security reasons.

But anyway I don't have to provide an explanation, the burden of proof is on you, this is America. So prove to me it's shill bidding.

Fact is, your statement of fact is way out of line and seriously open for libel litigation if the seller sees it. Many a forum owner has been slapped with a subpeona over blatant unwarranted statements of fact like this. But hey, if you're sure, and can prove this statement, no worries then right?

Well, out of the frying pan and into the fire I go. First, Bobby, correct me if I am wrong, but does not vette have to pay ebay on this sale plus the listing when catfood (aka- possible shill) buys a coin. So if there is not a true transaction, it still costs him money. In some form or fashion, is this not the same as putting a reserve on the coin? Second, I have never sold a thing on ebay, only purchased, but I would guess that a lot of people have their sister, or the like, put a starter bid in just to show some activity on the item. I seem to see boatloads of new auction items that have one bid on them almost immediately. I guess that this is some sort of shill bid, also. Does it really effect the auction? I would not think so. In reality, vette wants to put a reserve on the coin, but knows that reserves tend to push bidders away. This is just another way of protecting an investment. I really have very little problem with this. The coin is either worth another bid, or it is not. It would seem that the only people with hurt feelings were those who were trying to steal (get a great deal) on something. I suspect that if I were putting up a valuable coin on ebay I would use a reserve, that said however, I am sure that many other put in artificial bids in lieu of a reserve to circumvent the problems caused with one. Third, I go to a lot of auctions and they are replete with shill bidders, they are a fact of life. You either accept that they are the norm or don't go. It is the same with ebay and probably worse. Remember, "when you swim with the sharks, don't bleed".
Jim

Seatednut,

Just click on advanced search and do a search by bidder, then make sure you check even if not high bidder. It will only go 30 days. I have used this feature to find a few "no so honest" sellers.

I have gone through some of vettes completed listing with cathouse and have not found a coin reappear. I understand not leaving feedback if requested, it is really nobodies business what I buy and how much I spend. I know I do not leave feedback on high dollar items with the assumption none will be left for me. This is not to say that it is not a shill bidder, completed listings by bidder only goes back 30 days.

I have used the completed listings by bidder to find a couple frauds, one just recently on this board "Is this the same cent" There is no doubt that he was reselling "doctored up" cents.

I do find it hard to believe that cathouse would only bid on one persons auctions, especially some of them which are the same year and mint mark. I understand people upgrade their collections, but within a day of purchasing is hard to believe. I look at some of the buys wonder "what was this person thinking" they are sub par cents and not worth what was paid, but some people get "caught in the moment" and keep on bidding.

Anyways, ebay will look into it and if they find something they will act, if nothing is wrong then good for vette having an repeat buyer who pays!