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 Replies: 20 / Views: 6,292 |
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Pillar of the Community
968 Posts |
I know some people on this site hate dipping, but I think this recent Morgan I purchased is an excellent example of the benefits that dipping can bring to a coin that needs it. I certainly don't advocate the dipping of coins that have no need to be dipped (see the Norweb '93-S Morgan for a sad, sad story) but it really can help if you know what underlying luster looks like. I purchased a coin on ebay recently that looked high grade, and I was hoping that it would look great in-hand. The first set of images is prior to dipping it. You'll note the toning is richer, and the luster appears more subdued. Note the darker areas of toning over some of the high points, which can seem more like wear, especially when it obscures luster. After initially viewing the coin, I was a bit frustrated, as I had paid solid MS64 money for what looked like an AU58. Given the amount of time a professional grader spends looking at a coin (appx 10-15 seconds) they would likely come to an AU58 conclusion as well. However, upon closer observation, it was apparent that there was some semblance of luster under the darker areas, and the luster also appeared to be unbroken, just muted, meaning the coin was uncirculated. I then decided the coin would be dipped. So, here it is, pre-dip.   And here it is after dipping, just a couple minutes later. In my opinion, now a solid, higher end MS65.   |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
917 Posts |
What surprises me is it looks like you lost what to my eye was blue toning. But dipping it obviously brightened up the coin making it much more appealing. Whats going on with the "bar" under the N of in god we trust?
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Valued Member
South Africa
453 Posts |
All morgans are Great morgans, and that is a awesome example of the king of coins....in my opinion
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Moderator
 United States
56855 Posts |
Not a Morgan guy so...Is it normal for the coin to look so grainy? And what dip did you use? John1  |
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Valued Member
United States
108 Posts |
chasingtailbar, forgive my ignorance, but I am curious about what exactly you are dipping these coins in. I know nothing about cleaning, a.k.a. "conserving" coins ... after ruining a few Morgan dollars with Grandma's old silver polish and cheap paper towels as a kid, I've been afraid to ever attempt it again  But I must agree there are times when some intervention is required (I.e. Saddleridge Hoard) |
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Rest in Peace
United States
10625 Posts |
@John1 the grainy surfaces are the result of this die pair being used to the very limit and a bit beyond. http://www.vamworld.com/1886-P+VNA-1 This coin is actually not even the latest die state. They got worse (or better if you're in to chips, cracks and clashes)  Edited by dave700x
08/15/2014 07:13 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2368 Posts |
CT, what did you dip it in?
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Valued Member
United States
320 Posts |
As you guys know, I recently experimented with dip. Just like chasingtailbar, I found coins that I just knew were hiding massive beauty under some god aweful toning. After a quick dip and some spot treating, I ended up with a handful of 64-65 beauties. And they are just as striking as a graded one. I even did some very quick spot treating using a qtip to a proof morgan. It now looks as brand new. (Pics are on another post). I think some times a coin needs a little help to reveal its pure beauty. Just my opinion
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Pillar of the Community
Korea, Republic Of
1881 Posts |
Acetone dip I guess? Great results.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
898 Posts |
I don't really have a preference of which looks better, but I liked the toning on the undipped better I think. They both look awesome!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2815 Posts |
I won't ever get involved in dipping myself, but I gotta say that I absolutely LOVE the patina on this coin!
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Pillar of the Community
 968 Posts |
Quote:
What surprises me is it looks like you lost what to my eye was blue toning. Darker, non-terminal toning is typically the first to go on a dipped coin, followed by lighter toning. Toning is essentially removed in the opposite order that it occurs on the coin. Quote:
And what dip did you use? Quote:
chasingtailbar, forgive my ignorance, but I am curious about what exactly you are dipping these coins in. Quote:
CT, what did you dip it in? Quote:
Acetone dip I guess? To answer these questions... For starters, acetone won't remove toning, only organic compounds attached to the coin. Toning is usually a sulfur-based oxide and actually changes the surface composition of the metal, from what I understand. If I'm wrong please correct me. This coin got a quick bath in acetone (couple hours with no change) then a 2 second dip in ammonia, followed by a hot water rinse, a pat dry, and then another trip back into acetone for 24 hours. Quote:
I don't really have a preference of which looks better, but I liked the toning on the undipped better I think. They both look awesome! I like the dipped result better, personally... the undipped coin, while it had some decent toning, was far too dark for my tastes and lacked the luster of a nice MS coin. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7375 Posts |
Ammonia. That would probably be a good place to start experimenting (before jumping into ez est) after water, and acetone. Have read quite a few threads on dipping, but can't remember ammonia being discussed that much. Thanks for the tip.
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Valued Member
United States
160 Posts |
It would be interesting to conduct this experiment by cracking out a decent sample size of 64s, dipping, resubmitting, and recording the results. Would make a better argument as far as objectivity.
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Valued Member
United States
171 Posts |
My opinion I would have left it alone. You did loose some of the color and as far as luster goes it was still there but under the toning, and by twirling the coin it should have been able to be seen under good lighting conditions. I like my coins original as possible, so I myself wouldn't dip a coin. If you paid strong 64 money for it and you said looked 58, then there must have been others that thought it was a 64 coin also. Coindog, those marks under the n help identify the VAM just as the mark at the junction of the jaw and neck. There is also clashing on the reverse. |
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Valued Member
United States
71 Posts |
A lot of 1886 Morgans that are around were struck on these old dies. I bought several a while back, along with some 1889-P's that looked the same. The die cracks on these dies are very prominent. The crack goes through the hair and bonnet on the ones I purchased and it looks like this one is similar.
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Replies: 20 / Views: 6,292 |
Posted 08/15/2014 05:57 am
