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Counterfeit 1877 Indian Head Cent On PCGS Photograde?

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Author Previous TopicReplies: 13 / Views: 2,565Next Topic  
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RedRaider's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2014  7:34 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add RedRaider to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Look at the AG3 coin pictured in the Indian cents section of Photograde.

http://www.pcgs.com/photograde/#/Indian/Grades

Maybe a circulated proof? Definitely has the "Bold N" reverse, which is wrong for a business strike.

Wonder if this is floating around in a slab in someones collection.

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 Posted 09/03/2014  7:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chasingtailbar to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Doesn't look counterfeit. Circ proof is definitely a possibility.
Counterfeit-1877-Indian-Head-Cent-On-PCGS-Photograde?
Counterfeit-1877-Indian-Head-Cent-On-PCGS-Photograde?
Edited by chasingtailbar
09/03/2014 7:38 pm
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Pennynickelguy's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2014  7:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Pennynickelguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Good catch RedRaider, definitely something to make you say hmmm.
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 Posted 09/03/2014  8:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chasingtailbar to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here's another 3 from coinfacts;

Counterfeit-1877-Indian-Head-Cent-On-PCGS-Photograde?
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RedRaider's Avatar
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 Posted 09/03/2014  8:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RedRaider to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I say FR-2 on that one.
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BH1964's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2014  12:23 am  Show Profile   Check BH1964's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add BH1964 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I believe you are viewing Photograde and not CoinFacts correct? The OP coin is not on CoinFacts as an AG03 1877 MS Indian. Photograde is built for grade interpretation and not date/mm authentication.
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DVCollector's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2014  12:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Good catch Redraider. If that's a circulated proof, it's certainly the exception for that year, and an odd choice for a grading reference, imo. Perhaps a different year reverse got swapped?
Edited by DVCollector
09/04/2014 12:56 am
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jimbucks's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2014  01:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jimbucks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The reverses do not have to be the same coin as the obverse, right?
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mackwork's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2014  07:58 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mackwork to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Good point - the reverse may be from a different coin.
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Conder101's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2014  09:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The reverses do not have to be the same coin as the obverse, right?

Right
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RedRaider's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2014  10:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RedRaider to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you look at all of the coins on photograde, they use the same coin for the obverse and reverse. I thought about that, but it appears that the images of the obverse and reverses are from the same coin.
Edited by RedRaider
09/04/2014 10:47 am
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BH1964's Avatar
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 Posted 09/04/2014  5:28 pm  Show Profile   Check BH1964's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add BH1964 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Good point - the reverse may be from a different coin.


The reverse easily could be a different coin. Usually they are the same coin but Photograde is not for cert verification or authentication and is not CoinFacts.
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Conder101's Avatar
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 Posted 09/05/2014  09:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
If you look at all of the coins on photograde, they use the same coin for the obverse and reverse.

How can you tell?

Back when James Ruddy did Photograde in 1970 in the text he mentioned that they took photos or thousands of coins to come up with the images and they selected the best example for each grade they showed that grade most accurately, and that in most cases the obv and rev were NOT from the same coin.
Edited by Conder101
09/05/2014 09:58 am
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RedRaider's Avatar
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 Posted 09/05/2014  12:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RedRaider to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just look at the color patterns on all of the other Indian cents. The two other coins that should have the shallow N reverse for the dates are correct (1865/1867). I suppose they could be from different coins, but every other one in the Indian cents appear to have reverse/obverse images of the same coin.
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