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A Counterfeit 1861-O Half & Phony C.s.a. ID Disk ...

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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4416 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  12:20 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
These tend to fool a lot of collectors and dealers:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/19136457600...RK:MEBIDX:IT

I wrote to the dealer and gave him pages to Google, but the listing remains unchanged. As the seller has 100% feedback, I figured he'd want to correct his description.

Here's a similar one from my collection of fakes:


A-Counterfeit-1861-O-Half-&-Phony-C.s.a.-ID-Disk-...

A-Counterfeit-1861-O-Half-&-Phony-C.s.a.-ID-Disk-...
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jimbucks's Avatar
United States
4692 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  12:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jimbucks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not necessarily counterfeit, but has engraving after it left the mint. Description is deceiving though.
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Joe2007's Avatar
United States
3843 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  12:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Joe2007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This listing is textbook misrepresentation. Another illustration of why ebay's feedback system is next to worthless.
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coinlover168's Avatar
United States
506 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  01:05 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinlover168 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
He doesn't even show the reverse on most of his coins...
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jimbucks's Avatar
United States
4692 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  01:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jimbucks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
interesting. so it's bogus for sure?
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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4416 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  07:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Not necessarily counterfeit, but has engraving after it left the mint. Description is deceiving though.


I can assure you that this fake NEVER left the mint. THIS IS A COUNTERFEIT, NOT a coin. These are all the same, pot metal. I've personally examined a dozen or more of these. There is nothing original, contemporary to the Civil War, about these pieces. They started popping up in the 1990's.

Don't believe me ... here's a link to read: http://www.realorrepro.com/article/...cation-discs

Another link: http://www.relicman.com/fakes/zfakeIdentify.htm

These fakes are sufficiently deceptive so as to fool many a dealer, but they are underweight and if scrutinized closely, they bear but a slight resemblance to a coin.

A number of actual Civil War soldier's names were used. Thus, if one researches the soldier, they may be inclined to suspect a particular piece is genuine. However, if one does a simple Google search, they should be able to stumble upon info about these fakes. My hope is that, the more postings there are, about these and other fakes, the more chances collectors have to get informed.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  09:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
My hope is that, the more postings there are, about these and other fakes, the more chances collectors have to get informed.


This is what we do.

But yeah, they'd need to do a better job than that for it not to be obvious. One look at the obverse is all it takes.
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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4416 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  10:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
A longtime dealer at the Dalton, GA show had one of these in his case. Coincidentally, I had one of my similar fakes in my pocket. I had brought it to the show because another dealer had asked me about these at a prior show, and I had brought it to show him. While he was disappointed to see that his piece was a fake, he immediately removed it from his case. I encouraged him to share this knowledge with other collectors and dealers. Southern folks who seek out CSA collectibles are particularly vulnerable when it comes to buying these fakes.

In my travels, I also encourage dealers and fellow collectors to find the CCF online. As SSuperDave says, "This is what we do!"
Edited by ExoGuy
10/13/2014 10:10 am
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52Raymo's Avatar
United States
8516 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  10:42 am  Show Profile   Check 52Raymo's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 52Raymo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks Exo, that's good information and I appreciate it.
Oregon coin geek.....*** GO BEAVS ! ! ! ***
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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4416 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  1:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
52Raymo ... Thanks for the kindly feedback. I too enjoy the learning aspect of the CCF. Never too old, I guess!

BTW, I did report the item, since the seller never amended his listing. He may well have a problem with this sale when/if the buyer starts showing his purchase around. It's at $57 now, and could well sell in the hundreds. Having studied and collected Civil War ID disks for over thirty years now, I have yet to see a genuine piece from the Confederacy. Another item to be extremely wary of is a so-called "slave tag." There are genuine ones of those, issued by the City of Charleston, but many replicas exist.
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stampvirgin's Avatar
United States
1247 Posts
 Posted 10/13/2014  2:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add stampvirgin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"buyer does not accept returns"

that says it all.
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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4416 Posts
 Posted 10/14/2014  3:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's at $76 now with under two hours left. I wonder how long it will take the buyer to realize that he didn't purchase a genuine coin, much less even a relic of the Civil War?
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jimbucks's Avatar
United States
4692 Posts
 Posted 10/14/2014  8:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jimbucks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well, if the buyer wanted to press the issue the seller could be convicted of fraud. Apparently ebay doesn't care.

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ExoGuy's Avatar
United States
4416 Posts
 Posted 10/15/2014  12:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ExoGuy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
At $89, the buyer didn't get stung as badly as others I've seen. Looks like the buyers are getting more wary. Still, this fake will likely trade hands, again and again, for outrageous prices in the years ahead.
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Conder101's Avatar
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 10/15/2014  10:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
At $89, the buyer didn't get stung as badly as others I've seen.

True, I've seen these fakes go for multiple hundreds of dollars. The buyer of this one will be learning his lesson fairly cheaply. It's too bad, thanks to ebay, that he will be having to suffer the lesson at all.
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