Either The Greysheet Or Apmex Is Wrong (And It's Not Apmex)

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Author	Replies: 9 / Views: 2,465
supgog Pillar of the Community Israel 2420 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 05:20 am I've been wondering quite a bit about some of the GreySheet prices for US classic coins. Many of them just doesn't seem to be anywhere near the market prices, as I could see on my LCS and in ebay. Sure, a single transaction at a time doesn't necessarily reflect market prices (let alone dealer prices), but here's something which is hard to settle: APMEX is selling "Good or better" Barber halves for less than 10$ each (see http://www.apmex.com/product/26450/...d-or-better). While I don't have the latest CDN newsletter, their suggested BID prices for G Barber halves (no matter which year) didn't go below 14$ in recent years (and have been higher for a while). It is obvious then that if a dealer is interested in buying G graded Barbers, he might as well order from APMEX rather than paying BID price to another dealer. There are a few possible explanations for this issue. 1. APMEX is over-grading coins. I didn't get to purchase such roll from APMEX, but their statement is "This $10 20-coin roll of Barber Half-Dollars has dates ranging from 1892-1915 and will grade at least Good or Better. All coins have full rims both obverse and reverse. " Which sounds fair and the reviews for the item suggest that they are willing to replace any coin which the buyer founds overgraded. 2. There is a premium for the option to select the year / buy a single coin rather than a roll. This could be reasonable if we were not talking about dealers which by definition are buying/selling more than a single coin at a time, or if the difference between the prices wasn't 50%. 3. APMEX are selling the coin for less than what they are worth. In a (semi-efficient) financial market, such conditions wouldn't last (this is arbitrage, a dealer would buy it from APMEX and sell it for a significant profit), but it seems that the offer is there for a while for similar prices. 4. The CDN prices are outdated Perhaps the most convincing explanation. APMEX (unlike the CDN) are actually selling at the offered prices which gives legitimacy to the claim that their prices better reflect the actual market prices. What is your take on the (huge) price difference? Edited by supgog 10/30/2014 08:30 am Report this Post to the Staff

kanga Pillar of the Community United States 5825 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 07:42 am Some possibilities: AMPEX buys low grade coins at bullion prices or less, i.e., prices that don't reflect numismatic value. CDN quotes single coin numismatic values based on verifiable sales. Since CDN quotes numismatic values they cannot depend upon one or two recent sales to establish the current market prices. They need more sales (5? 10?) before they'll update their charts. And given their inputs (auctions, public sales, etc.) they don't get much data on Barber halves graded Good. And I bet they are a LOT more picky about the grades of raw coins. Report this Post to the Staff
dsfreeworld Pillar of the Community United States 4337 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 08:31 am it could be as simple as the internal relied upon "expert" that works at AMPEX is not up to snuff and is underpricing coins. When you get into corporate structures, they are not hiring necessarily based on true and vetted out Numismatic background as much as they are hiring based on candidacy interview prowess and other check marks that HR and hiring managers look for in the hiring process. So in the end you've got an opportunity to take advantage of some corporate lackey's market experience of lack thereof. I'm buying! Report this Post to the Staff
BuckeyeCoinGuy Pillar of the Community United States 711 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 08:47 am Sometimes these big online dealers price things poorly. I found a bunch of silver proof sets on provident metals about 2 months ago that were selling for less than 2% over melt + face value of the coins. They even had some of the silver quarter only sets going for more than the full proof silver set. Thank you corporate lackey indeed. I am a rookie here so this isn't my place, but with the quality of this forum and the number of users, I would think we could come up with our own open source greysheet / bluesheet / price guide that would leverage the CCF size and passion and produce a better look at current market pricing and do it for free. I am thinking we could do it on google spreadsheets / forms and just let people submit pricing they see. Report this Post to the Staff
dsfreeworld Pillar of the Community United States 4337 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 09:20 am oh there's no question opportunity for the CCF to create and true and real time data set based on what we're all buying/selling/trading at. It would be cutting edge for the industry if it could get pulled together. Report this Post to the Staff
just carl Bedrock of the Community United States 20753 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 09:43 am Always try to remember that ALL of the so called PRICE GUIDES are exactly that, GUIDES. There is no manufacturer's list price on coins like there is on so many products. Nothing to really go by except what someone, and most don't know who, just guesses. You too could make a price guide. Make up your own prices on coins and produce that info. Then you too could hear people say how your prices are off. Report this Post to the Staff
tkbslc Pillar of the Community United States 1158 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 09:57 am I think an important distinction is that APMEX usually does not sell specific dates and mints. This lowers the value because people looking to fill a specific slot as a collector cannot buy from APMEX. Edited by tkbslc 10/30/2014 09:58 am Report this Post to the Staff
BlackRabbitCoins Valued Member United States 113 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 11:17 am Most dealers in my area (Including myself)do not pay Greysheet for G to VG Barber halves. Not many collectors will pay more than $8 to $10 for Common date Barber halves in that condition. They are rarely problem free in that Grade range. Report this Post to the Staff
jmkendall Pillar of the Community United States 1590 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 11:50 am Dealers, myself included, pay a percentage back of spot on Silver Coins. We can offer more for some dates/mm's. but for 95 percent of our transactions it's a percentage of spot. $10 for Good Barbers is about what I sell them for, so..yeah...sounds right. Grey sheet is what I use to SELL, and, on occasion to buy when I the right seller. Report this Post to the Staff
coinlover168 Pillar of the Community United States 506 Posts	Posted 10/30/2014 4:32 pm I believe APMEX sells based on bullion value, not collector value. If you stay on any of their raw coins and refresh the page after a few minutes, the price changes because the gold or silver price has changed. Report this Post to the Staff
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