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 Replies: 30 / Views: 5,437 |
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Valued Member
United States
411 Posts |
Hello from a new member. I'm also a new coin collecter although I did it when I was a boy (about 30 years ago). About a week ago I bought a 1938 Walking Liberty half dollar from a seller on ebay. This coin has been certified by National Numismatic Certification as MS67, noting an obverse wheel mark which is invisible as far as I can see with a magnifying glass. But then, I've never seen a wheel mark and only read a definition a couple of days ago, but this coin hasn't got a single visible mark using a standard loop magnifying glass. Anyway, the PCGS online price guide reckons a coin like mine should be worth around $4,600. I paid around $250 for it. It has arrived. It's probably the most beautiful coin I've ever seen. It is pure white, it flashes and "cartwheels," the details look flawlessly sharp, both the field and devises look flawless to me and the strike appears to be excellent (although I don't really know where I'm at in being able to discern the quality of the strike unless it's just a disaster), the luster is white with no visible defects, and as I said, it cartwheels which is a word I learned from the PCGS grading book. (I can't post a photo of the coin because I'm too dumb to understand how to work digital cameras. Maybe I can figure it out in time to be still relevant.) Okay, if anyone cares to comment about anything I wrote above, especially about that particular slab company, any opinions or suggestion, that would be great because how did I get the coin I described for $250, more than $4,000 dollars less than PCGS reckons a coin fitting that description is worth? Also, can you have coins recertified by a different company? Also, what's a "third party grader?" |
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New Member
United States
38 Posts |
I am afraid that you have fallen prey to the grading companies who specialise in overgrading... companies like Gallery Grading, Numitrust, etc these guys never grade lower then MS65, if you are buying slabbed coins then stick to PCGS, NCG, ANACS, ICG...no dealer or collector will give you an MS67 price for this coin unless it has been graded by one of these companies, there was a link on this site somewhere with detailed review of all grading companies if I find it I will post it, also you can check on the PCGS price guide they have links to coinfacts.com which give you details about how many such coins they have graded, I checked and PCGS have only ever graded 10MS67s.. so that tells you that you either got the sale of the century or a non MS67 in a phoney MS67 slab... ebay is full of this junk, whenever you see someone selling a coin that they say is worth thousands.. check what the current bid price is and if its way way lower then this tells you that its not what it seems |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
Hi Stephen420
Welcome to the forum !!!
Im not a big fan of slabbed coins, and I can honestly say I know nothing about National Numismatic certification ,,Never heard of them !!
In most cases a coin that is is in a little known companies slab is not worth what the coin would be say in a PCGS,NGC,or Anacs slab, these are the top tier Third party grading companies, the reason for a coin being in slabs of little known companies like these is that they are most times over graded, perhaps even dipped or any number of other things that would make them unslabable,ungradeable, by the top companies.
Post pics when you can !!
Rick
Edited by Metalman
09/01/2005 1:09 pm
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New Member
United States
38 Posts |
To Add, If I were you I would post some pictures here as there are lots of experienced graders here who can give you an HONEST opinion, based on this that would determine whether its worth having this coin graded by a proper grading company, if its only an MS63 then the value is probably about 100-120$ and barely worth paying the fees to have it re-graded
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Forum Mom
 United States
5877 Posts |
As they say, "Even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometimes." By this, I mean that it is possible (though not probable) that NNC might have got one right. If you feel that the coin has potential, you can directly submit it to ANACS or ICG. ANACS is my preference. Their submission fees are minimal and they have very strict grading standards. Here is the link: http://www.anacs.com/index.htmlI strongly suggest breaking it out of the slab first. As I recall, NNC slabs are relatively easy to open. |
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Valued Member
 United States
411 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by smcc3573
To Add, If I were you I would post some pictures here as there are lots of experienced graders here who can give you an HONEST opinion, based on this that would determine whether its worth having this coin graded by a proper grading company, if its only an MS63 then the value is probably about 100-120$ and barely worth paying the fees to have it re-graded
I know this isn't a "how to work a digital camera" forum, but in addition to any general comments on methods of digitally photographing coins (such as what resolution etc.), I would very much like to post an image because it seems I've been duped on the grade awarded this coin by some sinister fly-by-night slabber. This camera appears to be: Canon Powershot S230 Digital Elph. It was a gift and I have never gotten around to it until very recently. In the incredibly unlikely event someone can help me use my camera I have two issues: 1. I can turn the camera on, zoom, etc. Also, it has flash on and I can't figure out how to turn it off. 2. Is there anything special one has to do to take digital photographs with sufficient quality that someone could grade it? |
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Valued Member
United States
411 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by smcc3573
... there was a link on this site somewhere with detailed review of all grading companies if I find it I will post it,...
That would be great and I'd be grateful if you could find it. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7123 Posts |
If your camera has a macro setting that would be the right one for shooting pics of coins from a close position 3 to 4 inches above the coin.
as for the flash ,Im not familiar with your particular camera but it should be a choice from the menu .
give it a try we all started with the first picture, keep in mind that there is a file size limit, and that will have to be adjusted, if you cant get it right ,maybe you can email it to someone and we can help in making the file size right .
no one will laugh at your attempts , well almost no one !!! LOL
Rick
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Valued Member
United States
411 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by smcc3573
To Add, If I were you I would post some pictures here as there are lots of experienced graders here who can give you an HONEST opinion, based on this that would determine whether its worth having this coin graded by a proper grading company, if its only an MS63 then the value is probably about 100-120$ and barely worth paying the fees to have it re-graded
I downloaded to my hardrive an image from the ebay web page where I bought this half dollar. This website (CoinCommunity) wont let me upload the image because it doesn't accept .jpg or .jpeg files, it doesn't like the name of my file ("1938_Walker.jpg"), it tells me that the characters in the file name aren't "valid" and it's too large a file (15.5 kb). I would be interested to know how to fix all this if anybody knows. The photo's not that good anyway and they only show the obverse. If you want to go to ebay to check it out, the item number is: 8327251388 Meanwhile, I'll keep trying to take a picture myself. Here's the link to the ebay web page: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...EWN:IT&rd=1sAlso: Thanks to everyone here for your comments and suggestions. |
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New Member
United States
38 Posts |
looks like our seller is checking the message board, the image seems to have been pulled from the ebay |
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Forum Dad
United States
24155 Posts |
Stephen, can you email the photo to forums@coincommunity.com . I'll check and see what's going on. It should upload fine, everything looks like it should go.
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Valued Member
United States
411 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by bobby131313
Stephen, can you email the photo to forums@coincommunity.com . I'll check and see what's going on. It should upload fine, everything looks like it should go.
Okay, thanks, Now I sent it to you, but I didn't know how to identify it so I put in a lot of blah blah information. |
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Valued Member
United States
411 Posts |
quote:
Originally posted by bobby131313
Stephen, can you email the photo to forums@coincommunity.com . I'll check and see what's going on. It should upload fine, everything looks like it should go.
I hope I didn't do this twice. Image:  1938_Walker.jpg19.75 KB |
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Forum Mom
United States
5877 Posts |
Sorry to be such a pain, but we really need to see a close-up of the coin itself (obverse and reverse). The pic with the slab does not show the details of the coin sufficiently to grade it.
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Valued Member
United States
458 Posts |
Question #1--What is a "wheel mark" never heard that term before-- #2--Since the coin is in a worthless slab (IMO), why not crack that coin out anyways, (be very careful & use white cotton gloves) most drug stores over by the womens section for the paint for nails have white cotton gloves). If it looks good after you post couple of good pictures it just might be worth sending to ngc or anacs for a legit grade and encapsulation. As far as your camera is concerned, most have like a botton or a menu setting that lets you shut off flash. The second thing is try to use macro if it has that, it also will have a seperate button to turn it on/off and with enof light whereas you can angle it so it shows the coin without reflecting light back at ya. Also the highest resolution is advised, but it could make the jpeg file to large to post here, so adjustments might be needed using photo software to reduce its size. Take pic of both sides and I see you now know how to post pics--Once you do that the people here will advise--If your afraid to "crack" the coin out, just take pics thru the case. BTW, welcome to our forum, as you see we have alot to offer and can and will try to teach, impart, pass along our knowledge for free--  Edited by CiScO
09/02/2005 1:22 pm
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Valued Member
United States
411 Posts |
Hi. I've snipped the post I'm responding to because you can just scroll up and read it direct from the source. #1: According to the glossary in PCGS'S Guide to Coin Grading and Counterfeit Detection 2d. revised and updated edition (New York, 1997-2005), a wheel mark is the same thing as a counting machine mark, which their glossary defines as follows: "a dense patch of lines caused by the rubber wheel of a counting machine where the wheel was set off with insufficient spacing for the selected coin." Like I said before, I can't see it. #2: I am actually afraid to crack the slab, not because I'm afraid of losing the NNC grade, but because I don't want to risk marking the coin. I have had the opportunity to examine many coins over the many years I've been on this planet - I got into the habit of looking at every coin that crosses my path ever since those days as a kid when my grandfather would take me to flea markets to buy steel nickels. I've never seen a coin this good and I really want you guys to have a look. If it's not what it purports to be, then I'd like to know what it is. I'm not an idiot and I have perfect eyesight and I also know the risks of ebay. I have already resigned myself to the probability that my coin is not what it purports to be. This isn't an issue of retail value. This coin has a tiny (maybe 1mm) nick on the obverse field; you have to hold it a certain way under a lamp and use your magnifying glass to see it. There are no other marks unless they're microscopic. It is frankly one of the most beautiful coins I've seen. Maybe it's been doctored, but I am a criminal prosecutor in the rackets bureau of the D.A.'s office in Brooklyn, NY, and I've seen counterfeit everything, including currency, but I've never seen a forgery as good as this, if indeed that's what it is, which I think it's not. Anyway, thanks again. I'll get those images soon. Cheers, Stephen Correction: In my original post, I said this coin was "white." I've since realized that it is not white. I recently purchased a really beautiful Wash. quarter that was rated by PGCS as MS-66. That quarter is truly "white" and "frosty." I was comparing the two coins and, next to the quarter, the Walker showed a very pleasant golden sort of tone. Maybe the coin was chemically treated, but that wouldn't explain the sharp detail, for example the rays coming from the sun on the obverse are perfectly and evenly raised and are 100% complete. Moreover, the MS-66 coin was a good deal more banged up that this Walker. |
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Replies: 30 / Views: 5,437 |
Posted 09/01/2005 1:04 pm
1938_Walker.jpg
