| Author |
Replies: 171 / Views: 18,906 |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
1476 Posts |
|
|
|
|
Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Quote: Will it do for coin ++ photography?
No. Full stop. The camera is nice, but overkill if you're going to use it only for coin photography. The 18-55 is a nice little kit lens, the one which comes with the camera from Canon, but it's barely adequate for full-coin images of a Morgan, much less a smaller coin. The 75-300 is as cheap as Canon can possibly make a lens, not terrible but utterly useless for coins and Canon's own 55-250 simply blows it into the weeds at its' designated task of zoom photography. Everything else will be the cheapest-possible knockoffs of the "real" deal. Now. The T5i uses the same sensor as the T2i (3 generations older) and for our purposes the additional capabilities of the new camera aren't relevant. In fact, right now we're recommending - for people who want to exclusively shoot coins - a used Rebel XS, a couple generations older yet and only 10MP instead of the 18 of the T5i. Those extra 8 megapixels buy you 900 extra vertical pixels of image, which means when you use the camera right, you're going to need to reduce the image size to 30% of original to post a 1000px image here instead of 39% of original. Think about that for a moment.  And, with the correct optics, the slight extra magnification required to make detail images as large from the one as the other is inconsequential. There's a Rebel XS next to me at my desk. It's what I shoot with. You can buy one in very good used condition for less than $200. So first let's define these things: Your specific goals for the camera, your tolerance for used equipment, and your willingness to engage in some fairly advanced learning. If you want an all-arounder which will be used for other kinds of photography, we're going to recommend a newer camera with the bigger sensor and better in-camera software. If your tolerance for a used camera (nothing else on your shopping list should be bought new - lenses don't know how old they are as long as they're clean) is low, obviously we find you something comfortable new. If you want relatively easy use, we're going to point you at some dedicated macro lenses costing more than the entire rig we'll recommend if you don't mind a little intellectual elbow-grease. And you will still need to learn 75% of what we teach to use that one right. We'll start there. 
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Canada
2784 Posts |
dar listen to dave I tried the t5i it is way over kill. if you know a lot about programing a camera ok but there is so many drop down window. you will they put a lot more information about videoing and it makes it hard to follow. dar unless you know this camera well. I bought canon t5 at Amazon for 386 dollars Canadian plus tax they are called open box. that is as good a deal as you will get anywhere. it is more user friendly. I am finally starting to get unto taking picture with the t5. I am even getting the hang of how to set it on the computer. follow dave and bill plus other member directions. they know there stuff all we got to do is listen and help one another. dar if you purchase a canon camera. the manual on the disc are so big print them in colour and mark the pages so it makes it more eaier to follow and set your camera have a great one
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
1476 Posts |
ok, thanks for the advice. I am against learning and have around $8-900.00 to work with. I'm Not against refurbed items either. As long as they work because what I get is going to have to last for along time until I can upgrade. It would be nice if the main body could be used on other then just coins but that is not a must at the moment. (It would just help justify the cost to my wife a bit.  ) But I'm going to need to fit what I need into that budget. I might have a little wiggle room but not much. So I guess I'll need the copy stand and all. I have 4 jansco lights but need the rest. Will you guy's be kind enough to help me out? I'm not lazy but it would be a great help if I could get a set up from you guys here. Even a 'package' would be Fantastic. If you can that is? Thank You Charlie
Edited by Dar 04/22/2015 2:13 pm
|
|
Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
OK. Regardless of what you choose for equipment, you still have to understand the basics of photography - Aperture, ISO, Exposure, White Balance and the like, and how they'll affect your image. You will also need to know how to crop images and save them in the lower quality required to keep the file size reasonable. Everyone who posts good images here has to learn this - it's that knowledge which sets the good shooters apart from the poor ones, more than the equipment. From there, the degree to which you can apply that knowledge directly affects how much you have to spend on equipment.
I can recommend equipment costing no more than $400 which will give images as good as anyone here, including microscopic detail. I won't spend more than $50 on a lens for coins. Or, a lens alone costing $500 or more, and you may be able to keep the whole rig under $900, which will *slightly* ease the process.
Whatever camera you purchase can easily be used for other purposes. The camera itself is exactly as capable as the lenses you attach to it. With a macro lens, it's a coin camera. With other lenses, it's a vacation camera or a portrait shooter or whatever you want. A brand-new camera comes with a "kit" lens, a relatively inexpensive all-around lens which will serve you ably while you learn the intricacies of photography.
But "point and shoot" really doesn't work for coins without expensive stuff and it will shoot huge images requiring postprocessing to post here.
Ray (rmpsrpms) is probably able and willing to put together a specific kit if you like, but I can't speak for him. I'll ensure he sees what you're asking here and offers input.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
1476 Posts |
|
|
Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
I hope I didn't intimidate you with the "learning" part. There seems to be a whole lot of complex different pieces that fit together, but in the end analysis it's all only about two things: How much light you allow to hit the camera's sensor, and how "deep" the focus is (depth of field). The only thing you can do to change the latter is Aperture, and that and everything else is just a whole bunch of different ways to control how much light gets in. Once you have the "eureka" moment in the process, it all fits together kind of nicely. I can do everything I do with a camera just by varying aperture and exposure. For me, everything else gets set once and forgotten. That gives you 95% of what you need - better than anyone using a simple point-and-shoot - and these huge multipage threads where we discuss arcane stuff is all about capturing that last 5%. But I'd rather intimidate you now, and have you discover it's easier than that, than sugar-coat it and have you find out later that it's more complex. I dropped a note to Ray to ask for his input. Of all the things I do at this place, teaching photography is my favorite. We'll do the best we can for you. 
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
4593 Posts |
So think about your use cases... for the equipment. That (should) drive most of your decisions
If you are using the camera JUST for coin photos, you will go one way. If you are using the camera for other things, there maybe killer features for that use. For example 1080p HD movies.
I have a T3i and the Cannon 100mm Macro lens (which I LOVE). Since I don't expect to use this for out-in-the-field macro work, I choose the 100 dollar cheaper non-IS lens.
-----Burton 50+ year / Life / Emeritus ANA member (joined 12/1/1973) Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, EveryCountry (online) coin club Owned by three cats and a wife of 40+ years (joined 1983) Author: 3rd Edition of the Sample Slabs book, https://www.sampleslabs.info/
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
1476 Posts |
Thanks guy's. The more I think about it, The more honest I have to be with myself. I am NOT afraid of learning every tiny thing I can about photography. The thing is I do want it mainly to shoot coins BUT I am known around the house for either getting up at the crack of dawn to walk around the yard taking pictures of everything from bugs and spiders to leaves and trees as well as staying up all night trying to hook up my cheap telescope up to shoot the moon with.  All with just some cheap point and shoot's. My Main purpose however will be coins as subjects. I am Never really happy with my results and want to learn more. So I can get the images I actually 'see'. From what I'm understanding so far, if I get a decent camera body that will cover more areas of interest, then the add ons, (lenses, copy stand, ect), are the things I will need to 'dial in' to what I am shooting at the time as well as the different techniques involved. Is this correct?
|
|
Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Quote: From what I'm understanding so far, if I get a decent camera body that will cover more areas of interest, then the add ons, (lenses, copy stand, ect), are the things I will need to 'dial in' to what I am shooting at the time as well as the different techniques involved.
Precisely. And everything you learn here will have direct application in your other areas of photographic endeavor. The camera by design will cover all but the most arcane areas of interest. And, for instance, the single $25 lens I use will cover all but the most extreme magnification requirements from full Morgans to date doubling. Until, of course, I fall back down the rabbit hole, wanting that last 5%. Then I have to spend another $25 on a different lens. Oh, heck. I already own that lens.... Seriously, though, there is the Printing-Nikkor 105mm which will cost you $2000+ for the best of the best. Then, the Rodenstock APO-Rodagon D 1x which will set you back maybe $300. It's hard to screw up the quality they give, much less fail to reach it. Then there's the 75mm Nikon you see mentioned here a lot for maybe $50 used, and below that a whole herd of roughly $25-ish lenses which will still make you a guy who gets complimented on his imagery every time. Being broke, I use one of those. But, someday, there is a Printing-Nikkor in my future....
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
1476 Posts |
OK, Are you suggesting a Nikon then? Not a Cannon? I was going to get the Cannon t5i refurbished from the Cannon web site for around 550ish but if there is a better way to go for what I'm wanting to do.... Or will the len's interchange?  See, I NEED to be schooled. I am reading Mark Goodman's book on coin photog edition 2 and will most likely finish my first read through this evening. Then re-re-reread it, but as I have said, I'm new. Charlie
|
|
Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Canon is the preferred brand for its' coin-specific advantages. Mounting one brand lens to another brand camera is trivial for our uses. That said, stay Canon-Canon for other uses so you can make use of the electronic interchange between them.
We don't autofocus for coins, and when you're running the whole thing with your mouse and focusing on your monitor (as you will) no camera settings matter anyway.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
9395 Posts |
Quote: The thing is I do want it mainly to shoot coins BUT I am known around the house for either getting up at the crack of dawn to walk around the yard taking pictures of everything from bugs and spiders to leaves and trees as well as staying up all night trying to hook up my cheap telescope up to shoot the moon with.
If you can do good high-resolution lunar/planetary imaging through a telescope, you should find closeup/macro coin photography much easier (except for the lighting). BTW, I gave up on lunar/planetary imaging a few years ago -- too difficult for me. Now I just do imaging of deep space objects (DSOs), usually with a narrowband filter and a camera lens (no telescope). In order of increasing difficulty (as far as I can tell): - snapshots, etc. - simple closeup/macro imaging - DSO astroimaging - coin imaging - planetary imaging and hard-core macro imaging (microscope, etc.)
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
4038 Posts |
What an interesting thread and discussion! Dar, it seems you are heading down a path that several others on this forum have made, and I'm glad to read the enthusiasm in your posts. That will make it much easier for you to learn what's needed.
THE most important question for you to consider when deciding on the choice of equipment is...what range of magnifications do you plan to shoot? What this means is what is the largest coin you want to shoot (large medals? ASEs? Dollars?) and what is the smallest coin or detail shot (Dimes? Low magnification details like full Date shots on a Dollar, or High magnification details like Mintmarks on a Cent)? This will determine the size of your setup, since larger coins need longer lenses and bigger setups, and high magnification shots will require a different lens, usually a microscope objective. It will also determine how fine a focus capability you will need, since doing high magnification shots requires very fine focus capability.
So answer that question for us, and we'll go from there with more questions and discussion. This ALWAYS takes a bit of time to get it right, but if you do the work up front to make sure you get the right combination of equipment, you'll make fewer mistakes and waste less time and money.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
1476 Posts |
ok, I will be shooting Dimes to Dollars, (3 cent pieces to Trade Dollars/ASE's) at least to start. Also, I am Very interested in error's, (who am I kidding, I LOVE error's), so I guess it will have to be good enough to shoot RPMS, VAMS, Clashes, DD's ect... Can the bellow's systems discussed in other threads be used with the Cannon I mentioned as well? I really can't afford the Macro len's at $1000.00 a pop for a while. Does that info help? Thanks guy's! 
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
9395 Posts |
Quote: Can the bellow's systems discussed in other threads be used with the Cannon I mentioned as well?
I have the Canon T2i, and it can be attached (with EOS-Nikon adapter) to the Nikon PB-6 bellows or (with EOS to M-42 adapter) to the late Pentax M-42 bellows I have. With a short 7mm? extension tube between the camera and the bellows, the T2i can also attach to an Olympus bellows (with EOS to OM adapter). The built-in pop-up flash gets in the way when there is no 7mm extension tube. I use the Olympus bellows mostly, since it seems to be the smoothest, and I use old Olympus OM bellows lenses. The Olympus bellows may be harder to adapt to non-OM lenses, though. Note that the various Canon cameras differ a bit in size, so some bellows-camera combinations will fit better than others. Some may require extension tubes between the bellows and camera. I suppose some combinations will not work at all?
|
| |
Replies: 171 / Views: 18,906 |