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Replies: 22 / Views: 4,394 |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
The silver spot price has taken a sizable jump of about $5/oz Cdn in the past month to now just over $25/oz. It's also the highest price in almost 3 years. 2 yr chart  Adding context, 10 yr chart  Source: http://silverprice.org/silver-price-per-ounce.htmlIf the increase isn't a temporary blip, is it enough to impact the price and/or demand of existing or new release silver NCLT? Thoughts?
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Valued Member
Canada
257 Posts |
I don't think it will affect current prices of NCLT silver, as items such as coins from the RCM have prices at 2-7x silver price. A rise in silver at 10-15% is quite small compared to this multiple. However I think late 2016/2017 releases might have a bump in their release prices - as it is a direct loss in profits from the RCM to keep the same prices. Just my 2c
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
2845 Posts |
I agree, I expect RCM will increase their price for new releases, and yes, for the typical NCLT the premium is so considerable it shouldn't make too much of a difference as of yet. As for older NCLT already selling at or near silver spot price, I notice it was quite a busy day on ebay for $5 and $10 1976 Montreal Olympic coins. At a respective silver content of 22.48g and 44.95g, it appeared not all sellers had adjusted their selling price and the bargain hunters were having a great day.
Edited by wildflowerAB 07/02/2016 4:08 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2366 Posts |
You also need to look at how much of that change in price is due to the change in value of the CDN $ vs change in the actual world value of silver (loosely defined as in US $s of course). Tends to smooth the peaks and troughs a bit.
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Valued Member
Canada
234 Posts |
Quote: You also need to look at how much of that change in price is due to the change in value of the CDN $ vs change in the actual world value of silver (loosely defined as in US $s of course). Tends to smooth the peaks and troughs a bit. Definitely agree with this. When I looked on Friday and saw the current price of silver the first thing I did was check the US conversion against our dollar to make sure it didn't take a drastic hit at the same time.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
2845 Posts |
Agreed, the value of our Canadian dollar impacts the Cdn price of silver. In this recent hike however, media reports indicate China is increasing the demand of silver as an attractive investment option due to expectations for Central Banks to further reduce interest rates. Another mentions 10% of silver supply is used to manufacture solar panels. If that's true, that's a possible motivation as well. Spot silver has increased in USD equally or better than CAD  Source: http://www. (059) Not Allowed - Auto-Removed * google it I wonder if any holders of $20for$20 are surprised to learn their coins are still only worth $6 something in silver content and not $26? The manner in which RCM markets their "fine silver" collector coins can be somewhat misleading to newer collectors. I suspect this will cause RCM to lose business from some customers who will chose to put their money into maple leafs or silver circulation coinage where the premium is much less.
Edited by wildflowerAB 07/04/2016 1:38 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5324 Posts |
There is no premium on x for x, unless the RCM does an about face they are worth face value, but the bullion coins carry a 3 to 5 buck premium or more just a cost of any bullion product.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2408 Posts |
The RCM may definitely increase their already overpriced offerings which could further drive NCLT collectors away. But let's wait for a few more days to see if this increase isn't just momentary. Five years ago some were predicting $100/oz. for the same reasons (semiconductor, solar, China, etc.). Back then I did not see that at all. The reality has been that demand for industrial application steadily decreased during this same period. This was explained by a stagnating global economy. Maybe. But what is interesting is that bars, coins and silverware - the glut - is what is driving demand up. So this massive stockpile of silver keeps increasing year after year. My guess is that as soon as silver hits $40 you will see an immediate flood of that glut back into the market. Price will drop down again. To put things into perspective, the worldwide stash is so large that we could produce enough solar panels to cover all the rooftops on Earth and then some. I also pointed out back in 2011 that the semiconductor industry was moving to cheaper metal solutions and this is absolutely the case. Some solar producers have already switched to aluminum. Device sizes and thicknesses are continuously shrinking so I'm almost certain that technological improvements will outpace usage of rare (and semi rare) metals. Why would it be any other way? Technology always finds a better, cheaper way to do things. But hey, if Silver goes to $100/oz. then I'll be the first one to enjoy and cash in whatever silver I no longer wish to collect. I'll probably be ready to retire anyway... :)
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:There is no premium on x for x, unless the RCM does an about face they are worth face value...... The topic is silver spot price, not face value. And if you don't think some buyers of XforX are in it for the sake of a silver investment, read RCMs product QandA. The topic of silver is one of the most common questions and no wonder...it's heavily advertised as 99.99% pure silver. "An easy and affordable way to own a silver coin that is among the purest in the world." It's easy to understand why young buyers might think they're paying $20 and getting 99.99% of $20 worth of silver.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:
To put things into perspective, the worldwide stash is so large that we could produce enough solar panels to cover all the rooftops on Earth and then some
 CCF Solar Panel Inc? Collectively speaking, we already have a fair amount of silver. 
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
6767 Posts |
Quote: But hey, if Silver goes to $100/oz. then I'll be the first one to enjoy and cash in whatever silver I no longer wish to collect. This will be the moment, when all the collections (I mean some average RCM 1/2-1oz coins) will finish their way as collectibles at dealers place. The dealers surely will buy for $70 per ounce, and new RCM coins will be priced $400-$500 for ounce....so all the stuff: proofs, coloured, unusual design and shape will be just thrown to the same pile, since the metal content will be important only. Btw, did you know, that Perth issued same design Star Trek coin as 20for20 RCM? But Australian coin: *Reverse Proof *Individual capsule *Bullion price *Mintage 50.000 only (low for bullion) so now, what people will buy - 1/4oz 20for20 , or 1oz for spot with some small premium?
Edited by Silveroid 07/04/2016 8:48 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1581 Posts |
Quote:
To put things into perspective, the worldwide stash is so large that we could produce enough solar panels to cover all the rooftops on Earth and then some
http://www.silverinstitute.org/site...olar-energy/70 million ounces this year for solar panel. SML sales are 30 million ounces per year. So, where that "stash" is, is all important. Can it come from new production, or must it be encouraged out of the hands of investors?
Edited by dialog_gvf 07/04/2016 10:14 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1581 Posts |
The RCM may increase prices. But, they would be smart to encourage the growth of sales, rather than kill that to maintain margins.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:
SML sales are 30 million ounces per year.
I'm not sure who sold 30 million ounces per year but RCM sold 10.6 ounces just last quarter alone and they definitely don't hold the world monopoly on silver sales. Wealthy raw bullion investors worldwide are more likely to hold bricks as opposed to SML. But physical silver holdings are only a small portion of what trades on the silver market because it's limited by the storage that is required. Buying or selling of investment instruments such as ETFs and precious metal mutual funds that are secured by contracts that are in essence traded paper also greatly impact spot prices as well. I think it's fair to say the typical collector/investor just goes along for the ride and where it takes us is entirely out of our control. Mexico is known to have huge reserves in unmined silver with cheap labour and low environmental laws. If China wants to manufacture solar panels, I'd be surprised they don't just buy the mines. And as much as the perpetual hype that silver is going to skyrocket to hundreds of dollars an ounce, silver is not used by industry as in the past because, to quote canadian_coins: Quote:
Technology always finds a better, cheaper way to do things.
The same will likely occur with solar panels. Meanwhile the possibility of negative interest rates is mentioned from time to time, particular in EU. It's a feasible option to hold precious metals as opposed to paying a bank to keep ones money on deposit and this could be what's driving the recent increase, particularly because of the Brexit vote.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2408 Posts |
@dialog
Correct, and 70 M oz is a small fraction of the total production in 2015 (887 M oz). The world silver reserve is estimated at about 600 thousand tons (almost 20,000,000,000 oz). That amount of silver could fuel the solar industry for the next 3 centuries.
Like with anything else, the "perception or expectation of rarity" can drive price up (momentarily) then reality sets it.
Make no mistake, there is a staggering amount of silver out there.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
2845 Posts |
Silver spot price seems to be holding at around Cdc $26 per ounce. I thought this flashback to the $50 silver peak in 2011 rather interesting as an example of how the the business of predictions may benefit RCM in the long run and since 2011, the markup of NCLT has also increased. For comparison, according to their 2015 Annual Report, silver sales were 34 million ounces and gold 953 thousand ounces, still under a million. Royal Canadian Mint sees silver sales up 30 percent in 2011 Tue Sep 20, 2011 By Jan Harvey MONTREAL (Reuters) - The Royal Canadian Mint is on track to raise sales of its silver bullion coins by around 30 percent to 25 million ounces this year and to match last year's record gold sales of around 1 million ounces, an executive from the Mint said. Speaking on the sidelines of the London Bullion Market Association annual conference, John Moore, executive director of bullion and refinery services at the Mint, told Reuters investors believed silver had more room to rise than gold. More: http://ca.reuters.com/article/busin...J3UX20110920
Edited by wildflowerAB 07/10/2016 09:29 am
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Replies: 22 / Views: 4,394 |