Strange Maria Theresia Thaler - What Do You Call This?

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Author	Replies: 6 / Views: 1,523
bungle Valued Member Japan 349 Posts	Posted 09/24/2016 1:59 pm Modern restrike, H62 I think. I thought there was some gunk stuck to the coin, but looking closely... Closeup of the most affected area: left side: the same area of a normal looking coin for comparison: Same sort of thing on the right side, but less pronounced. Die crack across the beak. Leftmost small feather under the dot between D and A is only half there. Reverse: Obverse: Edited by bungle 09/24/2016 2:04 pm Report this Post to the Staff

bungle Valued Member Japan 349 Posts	Posted 09/25/2016 10:57 am The frosty parts, most visible at the tips/edges of the feathers, I have never seen anything like it. Is it just because of a very worn die? Something else? Anyone find it interesting? Report this Post to the Staff
Albert Pillar of the Community United States 1915 Posts	Posted 09/25/2016 1:16 pm I wonder if it is some sort of counterfeiting process that leaves that sort of funny edges as being "thrown out" from centrifugal force. Just an idea- I really don't know, but I've seen similar. But what is interesting to me are the amazingly sharp and clear photos. It's rare to see such a wonderful picture in forums like these. They are so often so bad I don't even bother to reply due to eye strain. Can you share with us your technique and equipment or maybe make a post over in the photography section? Report this Post to the Staff
bungle Valued Member Japan 349 Posts	Posted 09/25/2016 7:37 pm Thanks Albert, I use a Canon sx710 hs. 20 megapixel compact point and shoot w/30x optical zoom. With enough light and a steady hand, the macro works well zoomed 5x to 10x *. ^ edit because the above must sound stupid. I mean the macro focus range is 5cm-10cm to 50cm, magnification range is only about 1.3x-2x. Zooming in as much as possible helps because then you can hold the camera away from the coin. The coin has the same dimensions and specific gravity, and otherwise looks the same as your usual modern restrike. Edited by bungle 09/26/2016 09:34 am Report this Post to the Staff
biokemist6 Bedrock of the Community United States 12437 Posts	Posted 09/26/2016 12:37 pm That is severe die erosion, frequently seen on coins struck with a open collar setup. When a die pair strikes a planchet, the metal radially expands to fill the collar. This radial expansion of the planchet wears/erodes the dies over time. The radial expansion of the planchet is even greater when a collar is not used, thus causing greater die wear especially at the periphery of the coin. Report this Post to the Staff
bungle Valued Member Japan 349 Posts	Posted 09/27/2016 11:21 am biokemist6, thanks! I don't have many coins made with an open collar, but I do have a few 1980-1982 500 schilling proofs. According to Alan Herbert, they were struck in an open collar like these MT thalers. Quote: Do they still mint coins in an "open" collar? This technique supposedly went out with high button shoes, but the Austrian Mint is still striking Maria Theresa talers in an open collar, which allows the coin to expand in all directions and avoids flattening the edge inscription, and the 1980-1982 500 schillings were also struck in this fashion. source: http://numismaster.com/ta/numis/Art...ticleId=7562 or the book "Coin Clinic 2" chapter 39. Now, maybe since they are proof, there is minimal die wear. But on one there is something else that I have never seen before. Peeling denticles? (As in lamination peel) Report this Post to the Staff
Spyro Valued Member United Kingdom 388 Posts	Posted 01/15/2023 03:32 am Hi. Learning my way round your excellent site and found this post. If the coin is genuine it looks like a really badly worn die. The fact that the effigy on the obverse is not frosted leads me to think that it's likely a Vienna Mint restrike from 1960-86. They're all "prooflike" after that date. When I've got enough posts to qualify for uploading pictures I'll do a few more about Taler identification. Report this Post to the Staff
	Replies: 6 / Views: 1,523

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