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Proof Being Sold As Circulation Strike?

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RoyCoinBoy's Avatar
United States
1609 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2017  7:21 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add RoyCoinBoy to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I found an ebay listing (hopefully my pictures won't rat me out) with no indication of if it is a proof. It looks very proof like to me, and a look at PCGS coinfacts strengthens my assumptions. I'm only showing close ups cause I don't want to be outbid
My evidence:
Coin up for auction has a die chip above the shield.

Proof-Being-Sold-As-Circulation-Strike?

Proof coin from coinfacts has a Die chip in formation, in the same area.


Proof-Being-Sold-As-Circulation-Strike?

What do you think?
Edited by RoyCoinBoy
05/28/2017 7:25 pm
Rest in Peace
Crazyb0's Avatar
10197 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2017  7:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Crazyb0 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Think the dentilces are different, then again pix sizes, not sure. Question to you because I don't have a clue. Could an out of service (retired) proof die have been used as the anvil die with a business strike hammer die. Could be reason chip on "your" coin is more progressed....?

If that be the case, that its just another error coin, not a proof strike, like the 1998 LMC's.

Also RCB, notice upper left corner of shield on proof pix has die chip starting as well an on "yours" is complete to rim as well. So, that is a VLDS of the same reverse die, known to be a proof. Now ID the obverse die, only way to fully at tribe that coin.
Edited by Crazyb0
05/28/2017 8:23 pm
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RoyCoinBoy's Avatar
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1609 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2017  8:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RoyCoinBoy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm not getting any google results for die markers, but here is the obverse of the coin. Tell me if you see any features that make it proof / not proof.


Proof-Being-Sold-As-Circulation-Strike?

Proof-Being-Sold-As-Circulation-Strike?


(It won't let me upload the entire image, so I had to make it half-and-half.
Edited by RoyCoinBoy
05/28/2017 8:40 pm
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Crazyb0's Avatar
10197 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2017  9:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Crazyb0 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry it took so long, trying to do too many things at once. Here's a side by side of "your" coin and the Obverse match of your reverse example above. Noticeable difference in clarity, LIBERTY is clearer on proof, the "webbing" as I would call it at the feather's joining is less on proof, fields are much smoother on proof example. On PCGS there were two other proof coins listed. I was able to see slight differences in the die stages noticing that die chip's changing. fairly sure that same reverse die used on all 2500+ proof coins made. Also, am sure the obverse dies are different. Only other far out possibility is that the planchet on "your" coin was an unpolished blank struck on proof die(s). I'm sticking with my first assessment of retired proof die being used for business strikes...seeing die was probably not worn out after 2500 2X strikes but could have chips, gouges and cracks showing by then. This coin would be a regular strike, grade as such.

Proof-Being-Sold-As-Circulation-Strike?
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Beefer518's Avatar
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887 Posts
 Posted 05/28/2017  10:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Beefer518 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not to mention, it's being offered by a seller (GSC) who has less then a great reputation. Coin has most likely been cleaned, and the color won't look the same in hand as it does in the photo. I'd pass.
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RoyCoinBoy's Avatar
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1609 Posts
 Posted 05/29/2017  08:10 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RoyCoinBoy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well, with all your opinions, I've decided I will not bid.
Here's the link if any of you guys like it.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1909-Indian...AOSwZKBZJLxO
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Debrajc's Avatar
United States
4211 Posts
 Posted 05/29/2017  3:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Debrajc to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Early on I did and won a couple of their auctions.
I wouldn't buy anything from them now that I am better experienced.
Photos and in hand are on two different ends of the spectrum and cleaned coins are the "norm".
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