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 Replies: 16 / Views: 2,430 |
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Moderator
 United States
34402 Posts |
I've been photographing my large cents for the 117 days thread ( http://goccf.com/t/283922 ). I had written on the 2x2 that this large cent had a T counterstamp, but in looking more closely, I wonder if the T isn't a transfer from another coin that was pressed against this one. What do you think about this? (Please ignore the weird toning as that is another issue with this coin). Thanks!    "If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1609 Posts |
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Valued Member
United States
226 Posts |
I think this is an die clash from one of the T's in 'states''.
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Moderator
 United States
34402 Posts |
@JTD, I hadn't considered that option. It looks to me like the T is incuse on my coin--wouldn't a die clash produce detail that is incuse on the die and therefore in relief (i.e. raised above the surface of the coin) on the subsequent coins?
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21786 Posts |
Not a die clash, but perhaps the previous coin got stuck, was then ejected, and this coin was then struck in the normal way.
Perhaps that may explain the lack of other detail of the previous coin, but not the complete obliteration of that detail.
That is MY postulation, anyway.
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
12477 Posts |
It's not a die clash or a counterstamp. That T came from another coin in some way, IMHO.
In Memory of Crazyb0 12-26-1951 to 7-27-2020
In Memory of Tootallious 3-31-1964 to 4-15-2020
In Memory of T-BOP 10-12-1949 to 1-19-2024
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3343 Posts |
From the overlays, the T is not in a position expected from a die clash.
(052) Not Allowed - Auto-Removed .com/largecent_overlays.html#.WT6ESLFlChA
Coin-to-coin contact seems more likely to me.
"Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
4911 Posts |
i vote die clash..lots of factors that could account for it being in the wrong spot compared the the reverse orientation...a rotated die comes to mind as a likely cause.
Feel free to call me Will.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2540 Posts |
not a counterstamp, it is incuse.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3343 Posts |
Here's a classic clash with readable letters. 1813 O-110. http://maibockaddict.com/1813-o-110...-half-dollarMany of the clashed letters of "e pluribus unum" are readable below the bust. They are raised and reversed. Spence's T is incuse, and had to be stamped into the coin somehow. "Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
Edited by thq
06/12/2017 3:44 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3516 Posts |
Very nice... Tough to tell..
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Valued Member
United States
226 Posts |
Another thought just occurred, could it simply be a dropped letter? I think there might have been a State Quarter posted on here a few years ago with a dropped T on the obverse. Edited by Jake the Dog
06/12/2017 9:52 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts |
vise job 100%.
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890 "Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis |
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Moderator
United States
34402 Posts |
Thanks everyone for the replies. I guess I'm not completely convinced that we've solved the mystery.  Quote:
could it simply be a dropped letter? @JTD, I had never even heard of a "dropped" letter. Here is a link to the thread that you mentioned, but unfortunately the pics are long gone. http://goccf.com/t/105892In a quick search on ebay, here is someone selling a LMC with a "dropped" letter: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1974D-Linco...AOSwMstYQy9vThat doesn't seem like what is going on with my coin as again, the T is incuse not raised. "If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12477 Posts |
The way I understand it, a "dropped letter" is when a letter that was filled on the die releases its build-up in the form of that letter shape onto a planchet or the opposing die. The coin is then essentially "struck through a dropped letter", so it would be incuse. The placement of that T, however, is a lot more consistent with being pressed by another coin. It's somewhat unfortunate in this discussion that the letter is symmetrical. If it were an incuse R for instance, it would be easier to determine based on orientation what happened (although dropped letters can flip and create mirrored incuse letters).  In Memory of Crazyb0 12-26-1951 to 7-27-2020
In Memory of Tootallious 3-31-1964 to 4-15-2020
In Memory of T-BOP 10-12-1949 to 1-19-2024
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
A "Clash mark" on a coin can't be raised. On the original die the features are incuse and reversed. When it clashes with the other die the impression it makes on the other die are raised and forward, just like they would be on a coin. The clash marks that other die then makes on subsequent coins will be incuse and reversed.
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Replies: 16 / Views: 2,430 |
Posted 06/11/2017 9:10 pm
