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Replies: 17 / Views: 3,501 |
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New Member
United Kingdom
17 Posts |
hi all, last month I bought this half groat henry viii coin and just very recently found out there is a lot!! of counterfeits are around which has drawn my attentiom. I have done my research and I cant find a one that's similar.. please can you help me out? also what should I do next if its fake? thanks liam   
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Moderator
 United States
34431 Posts |
Liam, first welcome to CCF. Second, maybe it is just me, but I can't see the pics that you were trying to post. Please try again--I'm looking forward to seeing your coin. If you need a little help, here is link to the uploading instructions: http://goccf.com/p/forum/tutorial-p...g-images.asp
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push." -----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed." -----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
516 Posts |
Also unable to view pics.
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New Member
 United Kingdom
17 Posts |
  done sorry guys.
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Moderator
 United States
34431 Posts |
@lsb25, yep those are great pics. I'll try to answer your questions, but will leave final determination up to someone here with more experience.
Anyway, that looks like the first issue of coinage from Henry III (1509 to 1526 AD). I say that because the hair goes all the way to the collar, whereas on the second issue, the hair is much shorter and the third issue features a nearly face-on view of the king. The missing nose is definitely odd (the portrait is actually of Henry II, and he definitely had a nose). The obv inscription should be something like hENRIC VIII DEI GRA REX AGL, although that last L is blundered. The mintmark looks to be a star, so consistent with #23 in Spink. The rev is quite dark and I'm guessing that someone has treated this side to make it darker (sorta like they probably did with the front, only they wiped off most of the tarnish on the front to really bring out the high points on the coin. A dip in acetone probably will do nothing to improve this coin, but it would be worth a try. I would NOT recommend dipping this in silver polish. Anyway, the rev inscription should be something like CIVI TAS + EBO RACI, which suggests that the coin was minted in York. It is a little too dark for me to be sure, but below and on both sides of the shield, I think that I see a key. That would mean that this coin was minted under the authority of Archbishop Bainbridge (1508 to 1514 AD). There should be a small bird (a "martlet") in the inscription somewhere too, but your coin is too dark for me to see it. There are a few varieties of these half groats, but that is my best guess based on what I see. If I'm right, then the attribution is Spink 2323.
Of course, you also asked if it is a fake. With that question, I can't help out so much. I note that your coin was about 19 mm and 1.6 g when minted, but the edge has been trimmed slightly so it wouldn't surprise me if your coin was a bit smaller and lighter. It shouldn't be significantly different from these values. Obviously, you should confirm that your coin won't stick to a magnet. Next, I'd work to clear off some of that heavy tarnish (hopefully someone here can make a good suggestion about how to safely do that). Nothing about this coin screams fake to me, but the tarnish could be hiding all sorts of things. Finally, the value of this coin in Spink is about $150, so if you picked this up at a flea market in Toledo Ohio for $5, then that could be a sign.
Feel free to post a pic if you end up conserving this coin!
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push." -----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed." -----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
2624 Posts |
Good information Spence.
My gut reaction was that it looks suspect but I am not sure. The approach is really to doubt everything unless it proves itself otherwise.
I am not sure why the warning about silver dip, what you don't want to do is use any abrasives (these scratch and damage the surface) but some of the chemical dips that remove silver oxide (the black) are OK as far as I am aware (I have used Goddards Silver Dip before with success). Anything you do use to clean it you want to wash off thoroughly and don't scrub at the coin.
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Moderator
 United States
34431 Posts |
@david, thanks. I agree that being suspicious is always a good idea. My warning on silver dip was based on my own prior (poor) experience. If you have used Goddards before with good results, then that is a great recommendation.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push." -----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed." -----King Adz
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New Member
 United Kingdom
17 Posts |
hi guys, iv tried finding identical ones either replicas or real the hair line doesn't match the fake or real,which is my concern also the star you suggested I noticed too, I have a Henry viii groat old portrait coin which I knew was fake just use it as a test piece to make a judgement in the future, this old groat coin I have the issue about is not magnetic either.
is there any house hold kit I can use to clean it without damaging it?
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts |
Going to agree w/Spence on this one, note also that the E in EBOR is blundered as well. I think it has been "defaced" quite literally, given the absence of a nose!
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890 "Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis
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New Member
 United Kingdom
17 Posts |
should I upload pictures with flash on? ive used a cotton bud on the dark side of the coin give it a little shrub if you want to see it now might be clearer to see.
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Moderator
 United States
34431 Posts |
Well, a flash might wash out details, but could also help show more detail. Give it a try and post your results!
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push." -----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed." -----King Adz
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New Member
 United Kingdom
17 Posts |
sorry will post tomorrow sorry , busy moving house
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
695 Posts |
you sure this is not Henry VIII?Inscription looks very much like VIII
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New Member
 United Kingdom
17 Posts |
yes it is viii I'm assuming its a young portrait
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
695 Posts |
Looks totally wrong to me. Too many odd shapes for the same design just feels like it was made to look old rather than being old just my humble opinion. When I see mushy details alarm bells ring
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New Member
 United Kingdom
17 Posts |
ill post another picture tomorrow, I'm ensure if its fake or not
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Replies: 17 / Views: 3,501 |