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1878-S Trade Dollar And 1853 Seated Half Dollar For Grading

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Valued Member

United States
275 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  10:53 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Dlangs56 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hi all, just picked up these two coins for my 7070. What say you? I'm particularly keen to hear opinions on the Trade's authenticity. I have no reason to doubt it, but have read on this site that there are a lot of fakes out there.

1878-S-Trade-Dollar-And-1853-Seated-Half-Dollar-For-Grading 1878-S-Trade-Dollar-And-1853-Seated-Half-Dollar-For-Grading
1878-S-Trade-Dollar-And-1853-Seated-Half-Dollar-For-Grading 1878-S-Trade-Dollar-And-1853-Seated-Half-Dollar-For-Grading

*** Edited by Staff to Add Year / Mintmark / Denomination to Title. Titles are Important! ***
Pillar of the Community
United States
1326 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  11:10 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add otto to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm not nearly an expert, but I've studied your Trade dollar and I think it's authentic. Haven't studied the half.
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numismatic student's Avatar
United States
11917 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  11:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add numismatic student to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Trade dollar looks about VF20 details cleaned with rim damage. There seems to be a severe rim ding in the Trade dollar with a 1" flattening at 4 o'clock. It also seems strange that if the ding is at 4 o'clock on the obverse it should be at 2 o'clock on the reverse when you flip it over. But it looks to appear at 4 o'clock on both sides which makes the obverse and reverse design positioning more than a little strange.

The half looks about AU55 and very sharp but looks overdipped by the look of the halos around the stars and fields stripped of luster. AU details cleaned.
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS
THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: "It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."
My coin website:https://fairfaxcoins.com
Edited by numismatic student
10/09/2017 11:35 am
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Zurie's Avatar
United States
5687 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  11:45 am  Show Profile   Check Zurie's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Zurie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would have concerns about the authenticity of the Trade dollar. The denticles are not uniform in length, and the reverse surfaces look a bit grainy. And stars 4 and 5 look unusually worn. Buying a raw Trade dollar is somewhat risky.
Valued Member
United States
275 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  11:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dlangs56 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My finger is covering some edge which makes it look like a rim ding on the Trade. I was holding it up near a window to try to get a better photo, but that may not have totally worked out. Thank you for the feedback!
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numismatic student's Avatar
United States
11917 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  11:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add numismatic student to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like it could be your finger. If so and it is round, delete the rim damage portion of my comments.
IN NECESSARIIS UNITAS - IN DUBIIS LIBERTAS - IN OMNIBUS CARITAS
THE MAN IN THE ARENA, Theodore Roosevelt at the Sorbonne Paris on April 23, 1910: "It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."
My coin website:https://fairfaxcoins.com
Edited by numismatic student
10/09/2017 11:51 am
Pillar of the Community
United States
1326 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  12:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add otto to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The denticles are not uniform in length


Could it be that the coin is very slightly off center?
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  3:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
AU-53 on the half, VF-30 on the Trade, no opinion on authenticity.
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Ploopy's Avatar
United States
1788 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  6:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ploopy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
AU50/53 on seated half, VF20 on Trade dollar. I vote real on the Trade dollar
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MikeF's Avatar
United States
3479 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  11:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MikeF to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Xf-45 might slide into au-50 on the half. Trade dollar authenticity is above my pay grade. vf-35 if it's real. Side note: I don't like the blue look of either coin. Makes me think they took a bath in baking soda but it could be the pics.
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Slider23's Avatar
United States
4472 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2017  11:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Slider23 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Half - XF Details Cleaned

Trade- VF Details Cleaned - genuine

On the Trade could you provide a close up photo of the hand holding the branch?
Edited by Slider23
10/09/2017 11:33 pm
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BH1964's Avatar
United States
10982 Posts
 Posted 10/10/2017  12:17 am  Show Profile   Check BH1964's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add BH1964 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
XF & VF Details and I agree with Slider23 that both are cleaned. On the plus side they both appear genuine in these images.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 10/10/2017  11:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Could it be that the coin is very slightly off center?


The image is not square to the camera. The moment you realize that's the case, you have to start discounting the perceived shape of details and spatial relationships. This is the coin with a perfect circle imposed into it:

1878-S-Trade-Dollar-And-1853-Seated-Half-Dollar-For-Grading

That small amount of "out-of-round" is sufficient to distort the appearance of denticles and date location, for instance. It's why we harp so often on shooting a coin absolutely square to the camera.

So, in this case, I don't feel I can offer an opinion of authenticity based on the denticle evidence.
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