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 Replies: 40 / Views: 4,137 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3479 Posts |
@numismatic student: If you already know the grade, it's better to recuse yourself from offering an opinion. It just confuses everyone and limits the accuracy of opinions. That's just my opinion but seems like the common sense and honest thing to do.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
6370 Posts |
I completely forgot about this thread. This coin graded AU-50. It has been harshly cleaned, and there were some notable scratches on the obverse. When it was in its raw state, not a single person wanted it for $250. A dealer even scoffed at it for that price. After it graded, I sold it for $400 to a dealer before I even got it back from PCGS. This shows two things: 1) PCGS is incompetent with grading early US coins, and 2) there is a major value discrepancy between raw and certified coins, regardless of how much you don't believe it. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3479 Posts |
Quote:
there is a major value discrepancy between raw and certified coins, regardless of how much you don't believe it. I thought this was common knowledge. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6370 Posts |
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I thought this was common knowledge. You'd be surprised. I've had a debate with other collectors who insist that raw coins and certified coins are worth the same, but the unknowledgeable create the value gap (aka, "A coin is worth what a knowledgeable collector would pay."). I see the logic, but unfortunately, the market does not work like that... Which is worth more: an MS-69 Wheat cent or the same MS-69 Wheat cent in an accurately-graded plastic tomb? Same coin, two vastly different values. Seems illogical, doesn't it? But that is how things are. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
683 Posts |
This is why I usually avoid PCGS graded coins like the plague ( especially when it comes to early/colonial stuff).
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
I suspect that this coin may have been slightly bent and re straightened at some time in the past.
The various 'details' would not bother me too much, and I would take advantage of those 'details' in a price negotiation, if I were to consider to buy it. None of the 'details' are really bad.
In terms of wear, this is an above average coin and that is definitely a positive for it. That is what attracts me to it.
When you have a love of ancient coins as I do, all factors are taken into account to determine a valuation. Despite everything, is is still a reasonably attractive coin.
Overall, VF25.
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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This shows two things: 1) PCGS is incompetent with grading early US coins No it doesn't at all. You've been known to blast TPGs before on coins you were wrong about. No one wanted to buy that coin raw because of number 2 and you're a teen trying to sell them a raw bust quarter that's going to raise a lot of red flags most will just pass on like they did. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
683 Posts |
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No it doesn't at all. You've been known to blast TPGs before on coins you were wrong about.
The fact he has been wrong before doesn't eliminate him from being able to have opinions on PCGS (opinions that are probably shared by many others). Quote:
No one wanted to buy that coin raw because of number 2 and you're a teen trying to sell them a raw bust quarter that's going to raise a lot of red flags most will just pass on like they did. And to be honest, that seems to say more about the dealer than it does about typecoin. And it seems to show that some dealers are less confident in their own opinion on a coin then they do over a TPG's opinion, which is pretty unfortunate seeing as many collectors that I've encountered (in person and online) seem to disagree with a lot of PCGS grading decisions. |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:And to be honest, that seems to say more about the dealer than it does about typecoin. And it seems to show that some dealers are less confident in their own opinion on a coin then they do over a TPG's opinion, which is pretty unfortunate seeing as many collectors that I've encountered (in person and online) seem to disagree with a lot of PCGS grading decisions. It's not a secret most dealers are discriminatory against younger collectors which is why most of us stay online for purchases. Anyone who thinks PCGS cant's grade classic coins needs to improve their own grading drastically. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3479 Posts |
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You'd be surprised. I've had a debate with other collectors who insist that raw coins and certified coins are worth the same, but the unknowledgeable create the value gap (aka, "A coin is worth what a knowledgeable collector would pay."). I see the logic, but unfortunately, the market does not work like that...
Then they are in total denial and refuse to accept facts. The TPG grade is a necessary insurance policy especially when you're buying coins based off of pictures. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6370 Posts |
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You've been known to blast TPGs before on coins you were wrong about Problem coins should not grade problem-free, worn coins should not be graded MS, and key dates should not be given a bump. Those are my main gripes. I think you can agree. But I will admit that their incompetence is not universal among classic US coins. They do often grade the coins correctly. Quote:
No one wanted to buy that coin raw because of number 2 and you're a teen trying to sell them a raw bust quarter that's going to raise a lot of red flags most will just pass on like they did. I was selling it as cleaned at a "cleaned" price based on sale records, so I don't know how it would come across as a scam. If they can't judge authenticity and approximate grade themselves, then they should not be dealers. Edited by TypeCoin971793
11/26/2017 9:55 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6370 Posts |
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If they can't judge authenticity and approximate grade themselves, then they should not be dealers. Geez... that was a bit harsh... EDIT: What I was meaning was to single out dealers who lowball because they have no idea as to authenticity or can't tell VG from VF. I think it is perfectly understandable for a dealer to err on the side of caution if the coin seems off, the coin is on the verge of AU-58 and MS, or if a small grade difference means a huge price jump. I'd be a hypocrite if I said that wasn't okay. Edited by TypeCoin971793
11/26/2017 10:18 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
683 Posts |
Quote:. Then they are in total denial and refuse to accept facts. The TPG grade is a necessary insurance policy especially when you're buying coins based off of pictures. I agree with what you mean about when buying based off pictures, however I find it unfortunate that these days people are paying more for coins just because a TPG said it was a grade. Now I can understand if we're talking about something like a rare/key date or something and you want it authenticated, in fact when it comes to authentication PCGS would probably be My go to guys, but when it comes to grading (in My opinion) it seems that people have become so unsure in their own opinion/grading that it seems that some forgot about who's opinion on the coin matters most, their own. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
683 Posts |
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Problem coins should not grade problem-free, worn coins should not be graded MS, and key dates should not be given a bump. Those are my main gripes. I think you can agree.  Its like you read My mind. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
683 Posts |
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.Anyone who thinks PCGS cant's grade classic coins needs to improve their own grading drastically. I'm not denying they can, but when it come to a coin that I've personally graded say vg-10 and 10 collectors agree and 3 say vg-8 and then the coin comes back f-15 then I'm probably not gonna be interested in buying the coin, at least not for f-15 money. |
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Replies: 40 / Views: 4,137 |
First Page
Posted 11/26/2017 8:11 pm
