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Can You Help ID 3 Small Ae Warrior On Horseback Coins - Labeled C. 1220 Ad?

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Author Previous TopicReplies: 8 / Views: 2,400Next Topic  
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Seeker55's Avatar
United States
635 Posts
 Posted 01/26/2018  10:20 pm Show Profile   Check Seeker55's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add Seeker55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
These three different small copper coins all show a warrior on horseback and are labeled "ca. 1220 AD." Any help identifying these will be greatly appreciated.

Coin 1 weighs 2.71 g and is 14 mm.
It has a large realistic figure of a rider on horseback on one side and perhaps an animal on the other, facing left (see tail in upper right). It's hard to make out this animal in the photos I've taken. There's an extra blob of metal on the upper reverse that appears to be a manufacturing defect - not part of the design. This coin might even be a bull & horseman but it's realistic, not stylized, so I'm not sure.

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?


Coin 2 weighs 2.66 g and is 16 mm.
Rider on horseback on one side and Arabic writing on the other.

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?

Coin 3 weighs 2.43 g and is 14 mm.
Rider on horseback on one side and Arabic writing (different from coin 2) on the other.

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?

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Kamnaskires's Avatar
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 Posted 01/26/2018  11:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kamnaskires to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Some of these (2nd and 3rd) might be lions or leopards rather than horses. I'm suspecting Artuqids for those. Hopefully Finn will check in. In the meantime, Seeker, can you provide larger/closer pics? Really hard to see much here.
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Seeker55's Avatar
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635 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2018  10:33 am  Show Profile   Check Seeker55's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Seeker55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the suggestions. Here are some additional photos (the initial ones were scans). Hopefully this will help, though the coins are small and worn, and my photo setup is not the greatest.

Here's also a photo of one of the labels that came with each of these. Judging by the label, they appear to come from a museum or major dealer.

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?


Coin 1
(animal's raised stubby tail visible in upper right on reverse, legs are also visible)

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?

Coin 2

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?

Coin 3

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
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Seeker55's Avatar
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635 Posts
 Posted 01/28/2018  7:22 pm  Show Profile   Check Seeker55's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Seeker55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here are a couple more photos, maybe a bit clearer.

Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
Can-You-Help-ID-3-Small-Ae-Warrior-On-Horseback-Coins---Labeled-C.-1220-Ad?
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Seeker55's Avatar
United States
635 Posts
 Posted 02/01/2018  9:16 pm  Show Profile   Check Seeker55's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Seeker55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Have found some similar coins (similar weight, armed rider on horseback, arabic writing) from this time period from Khwarezm Empire, but no exact matches so far.

For example,
https://www.poinsignon-numismatique...e_80100.html

and

https://www.poinsignon-numismatique...e_79461.html
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Seeker55's Avatar
United States
635 Posts
 Posted 02/01/2018  9:24 pm  Show Profile   Check Seeker55's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Seeker55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here's another similar one, from Numista

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces59135.html

I'm starting to think it's likely that the three unknown coins above may be billon jitals from Khwarezm, approximately 1200 AD, but would love to have a better photo match.
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Seeker55's Avatar
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635 Posts
 Posted 02/01/2018  9:25 pm  Show Profile   Check Seeker55's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Seeker55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm also starting to think that for Coin 1, the reverse is not an animal but more Arabic writing, very worn and upside down in the photos.
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Seeker55's Avatar
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 Posted 02/02/2018  10:43 am  Show Profile   Check Seeker55's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Seeker55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So, unless there's a better attribution for these, I'll go with probable Khwarezm Empire (present-day Afghanistan) billon jitals, ca. 1200 AD, possibly Muhammad II.
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Kamnaskires's Avatar
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7066 Posts
 Posted 02/02/2018  10:55 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Kamnaskires to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Good call, I think. The close-up pics certainly do suggest horses rather than lions/leopards.
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